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Revision as of 23:07, 13 July 2014

	Blue men of the Minch is a featured article; it (or a previous version of it) has been identified as one of the best articles produced by the Misplaced Pages community. Even so, if you can update or improve it, please do so.
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"In popular culture"

So, Charles Mackay wrote a poem "The Kelpie of Corryvreckan" (also spelled Corrievreckan") which Ruth Gipps set to music. Here's a quick summary: "It tells of a fair and a fickle maid who leaves her lover for the Kelpie and finds out too late that his abode is at the bottom of the sea where, of course, she is drowned as an awful warning to all fickle maidens." See JSTOR 921816. Also The Kelpie of Corrievreckan, for Clarinet and Piano by Ruth GippsReview by: E. L.Music & Letters, Vol. 24, No. 1 (Jan., 1943), p. 63Published by: Oxford University PressStable URL: http://www.jstor.org/stable/728626. Drmies (talk) 02:48, 19 June 2014 (UTC)

Interesting, thanks for that. I had a JSTOR search done, but only for blue men, so I didn't catch these kelpie references. I'll add something later. Eric Corbett 12:25, 19 June 2014 (UTC)

Sure thing. One thing led to another. The Corryvreckan article gave me a few more terms to search, including "fir gorma". I just emailed you a book review, of limited use in its own right, but it confirms "blue-men" = "fir gorma" = "Africans". There has to be more on that topic, though. Drmies (talk) 17:51, 19 June 2014 (UTC)

Indeed there must. I for one was rather surprised to learn that the Vikings traded in slaves from North Africa, and brought them over here to the UK. Eric Corbett 18:04, 19 June 2014 (UTC)

A Google book search delivers a few interesting hits--this is perhaps the most useful (hope you can read it). This is interesting also (it notes the burial of a young African girl in 10th century Norfolk). Here is a note on otherness--remember the Cohen text I added to our Green Children? This is interesting too, an edition of the Caithréim Chellacháin Chaisil, citing the Irish Annals. Drmies (talk) 17:57, 19 June 2014 (UTC)

Corryvreckan/"localised to the Minch"

If they are found at Corryvreckan they can't also be "localised to the Minch, unknown in other parts of Scotland ". Mutt Lunker (talk) 20:33, 12 July 2014 (UTC)

So where do you think the Corryvreckan is? Eric Corbett 20:43, 12 July 2014 (UTC)

Between Jura and Scarba and nowhere near the Minch. Mutt Lunker (talk) 20:51, 12 July 2014 (UTC)

So is it your argument that the Little Minch isn't part of the Minch? Eric Corbett 22:17, 12 July 2014 (UTC)

No? My point is simple, that Corryvreckan is not in, or even near, the Minch (or in the Little Minch since you raise that). Your combative and insulting tone is not endearing you to me, particularly when it is your geographical knowledge which is at fault. Mutt Lunker (talk) 22:52, 12 July 2014 (UTC)

It's you that's simple. Eric Corbett 23:55, 12 July 2014 (UTC)

"fuck off moron" - is that your level of debate? Are you contending that the map at this article places the location of the Minch, the Little Minch, Jura and/or Scarba incorrectly? Corryvreckan and the Minch are a considerable distance apart, this article effectively states that the former is in the latter and swearing doesn't make the matter go away. Please address factual matters rather than simply resorting to insult. However, as I am losing hope that you will do so, I've also taken the matter here. Mutt Lunker (talk) 08:38, 13 July 2014 (UTC)

I learned years ago that arguing with a fool make you the greater fool. Eric Corbett 23:07, 13 July 2014 (UTC)

The addition to make the phrase "localised to the Minch and surrounding areas" is somewhat of an improvement but if "surrounding" now includes locations almost 100 miles away from the Minch, past various other stretches of water and islands, this is no longer, as described elsewhere in the article, "a very restricted area". It would now encompass the bulk of the Hebrides and a very large stretch of the west coast and possibly, by implication of its extent of "surrounding", extend a similar distance along the north coast.

Were they found throughout the Hebrides or just in the Minch and Corryvreckan, not in between? Are the "storm kelpies" at Corryvreckan a different phenomenon from the blue men? Martin Martin's description of the whirlpool mentions no blue men, only that "where the white Waves meet and spout up: they call it the Kaillach, i.e. and old hag". His mention that the natives of Jura are "black of Complexion" is in a later paragraph than that about Corryvreckan and he does not link the two, neither attributing the whirlpool to them or stating that they inhabit it. The Macgregor source does not mention blue men either. If there is a passage linking Corryvreckan and blue men it should be noted, if not this assertion is WP:SYNTH.

It looks to me like mention of Corryvreckan as part of the blue men phenomenon is not supported and, unless and until it is, should be removed. Mutt Lunker (talk) 10:10, 13 July 2014 (UTC)

The article lacks clarity in the description of storm kelpies as .. "mythological creatures inhabiting the stretch of water between the northern Outer Hebrides and mainland Scotland ... (which) appear to be localised to the Minch and surrounding areas, unknown in other parts of Scotland and without counterparts in the rest of the world" given that the Kelpie article states that .."Almost every sizeable body of water in Scotland has an associated kelpie story" whilst Selkies appear to be similar. Shipsview (talk) 22:11, 13 July 2014 (UTC)

This is getting to be fucking ridiculous. How many simpletons are there here on WP? Eric Corbett 23:06, 13 July 2014 (UTC)

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