| Revision as of 17:28, 12 August 2015 editBeeblebrox (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Administrators113,540 edits →Requested move 12 August 2015: groan← Previous edit | Revision as of 17:30, 12 August 2015 edit undoIzkala (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Extended confirmed users, Pending changes reviewers, Rollbackers29,341 edits →Requested move 12 August 2015: cNext edit → | ||
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| * '''Support''' move and rewrite. The essay and article name are easily misunderstood, and wording in suicide metaphers is hardly civil, not even funny. On top of moving, it should also been used less. (I have seen one editor made unhappy by the usage, which is one too many.) --] (]) 16:50, 12 August 2015 (UTC) | * '''Support''' move and rewrite. The essay and article name are easily misunderstood, and wording in suicide metaphers is hardly civil, not even funny. On top of moving, it should also been used less. (I have seen one editor made unhappy by the usage, which is one too many.) --] (]) 16:50, 12 August 2015 (UTC) | ||
| *'''Oppose move''' for the same reason as I opposed the deletion, just because you don't like it doesn't means it must change. I'd also like to point out that ] only counts when the person wants it. ] (]) 16:52, 12 August 2015 (UTC) | *'''Oppose move''' for the same reason as I opposed the deletion, just because you don't like it doesn't means it must change. I'd also like to point out that ] only counts when the person wants it. ] (]) 16:52, 12 August 2015 (UTC) | ||
| ** Do hold it against me for cursing while under distress. You're a disgusting individual. ] (]) 17:30, 12 August 2015 (UTC) | |||
| * '''Oppose move''': My comment at the ] are still mostly relevant. If this essay is being used to advocate for suicide, that's disgusting. But it also isn't a reason to throw the baby out with the bathwater. This essay is a colorful adage with a good teaching behind it. If the essay is being misused, that's a reflection of the user who misuses it, not necessarily on the essay itself. --''']''' <small>(] • ])</small> 16:53, 12 August 2015 (UTC) | * '''Oppose move''': My comment at the ] are still mostly relevant. If this essay is being used to advocate for suicide, that's disgusting. But it also isn't a reason to throw the baby out with the bathwater. This essay is a colorful adage with a good teaching behind it. If the essay is being misused, that's a reflection of the user who misuses it, not necessarily on the essay itself. --''']''' <small>(] • ])</small> 16:53, 12 August 2015 (UTC) | ||
| **You're an involved admin. <span class="vcard"><span class="fn">]</span> (<span class="nickname">Pigsonthewing</span>); ]; ]</span> 17:21, 12 August 2015 (UTC) | **You're an involved admin. <span class="vcard"><span class="fn">]</span> (<span class="nickname">Pigsonthewing</span>); ]; ]</span> 17:21, 12 August 2015 (UTC) | ||
| ***{{ping|Pigsonthewing}} And....? --''']''' <small>(] • ])</small> 17:22, 12 August 2015 (UTC) | ***{{ping|Pigsonthewing}} And....? --''']''' <small>(] • ])</small> 17:22, 12 August 2015 (UTC) | ||
| *'''Oppose move''' And all other attempts to turn this into a histrionic, handwringing, wishy-washy essay. I had taken this off my watchlist because it had been stable for so long and was widely cited in discussions, I figured it was off on its own now and would remain stable, but apparently we have to now re-write so that people who don't understand what a metaphor is won't be scared by it and think we are actually going to cause them to be hanged. I'd rather see it deleted than see any of that happen. If you want an essay that says soemthing other than what this one is says, write it already. Add it to the "see also" section on this essay if you like, but don't destroy this oft-cited essay just because you don't persoanlyl happen to like it. ] (]) 17:28, 12 August 2015 (UTC) | *'''Oppose move''' And all other attempts to turn this into a histrionic, handwringing, wishy-washy essay. I had taken this off my watchlist because it had been stable for so long and was widely cited in discussions, I figured it was off on its own now and would remain stable, but apparently we have to now re-write so that people who don't understand what a metaphor is won't be scared by it and think we are actually going to cause them to be hanged. I'd rather see it deleted than see any of that happen. If you want an essay that says soemthing other than what this one is says, write it already. Add it to the "see also" section on this essay if you like, but don't destroy this oft-cited essay just because you don't persoanlyl happen to like it. ] (]) 17:28, 12 August 2015 (UTC) | ||
Revision as of 17:30, 12 August 2015
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Suicide
I wonder if there's a way to express this concept that doesn't reference (and wikilink) suicide? The use of 'rope' and 'hanging' is direct and graphic, complete with diagram and reference to a hangman at the switch (actually not consistent with the proverb on self-hanging). What seems to make it more distasteful is the mutual wikilinking with the essay Misplaced Pages Is Not Therapy, thus collaterally linking in real psychological disturbance and suicidality. It is surprising to see that the primary creator of this is a senior Wikipedian with admin, oversight and arbitration roles. It is clear there has been a need to assert boundaries under pressure. But it seems strange this essay makes it into Misplaced Pages space in this form, yet User:Beeblebrox/The_unblockables does not even though it seems to address an important reality (which perhaps does not want to be more widely admitted). Sighola2 (talk) 17:39, 13 March 2014 (UTC)
- On a different note, I mentioned WP:ROPE recently, and I had the unintended response that I was implying an editor would hang themselves, as oppose to being a net asset if they were unblocked. I've added to the article that the title and the WP:ROPE shortcut can be be taken as uncivil. Perhaps this essay should be renamed, or merged with Misplaced Pages:Unblocks are cheap.—Bagumba (talk) 08:10, 27 July 2015 (UTC)
- If they are that incompentent they shouldn't be here. Hell in a Bucket (talk) 16:53, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
Requested move 12 August 2015
 | It has been proposed in this section that Misplaced Pages:Give 'em enough rope be renamed and moved somewhere else, with the name being decided below. A bot will list this discussion on the requested moves current discussions subpage within an hour of this tag being placed. The discussion may be closed 7 days after being opened, if consensus has been reached (see the closing instructions). Please base arguments on article title policy, and keep discussion succinct and civil. Please use {{subst:requested move}}. Do not use {{requested move/dated}} directly. Links: current log |  |
Misplaced Pages:Give them enough rope → Misplaced Pages:Give second chances – This essay should be moved to Misplaced Pages:Give second chances (a recent good-faith move by User:Alakzi to that name was reverted). The page already caries the notice "Using the rope analogy directly can be regarded as uncivil and a lack of good faith"
, and the current title is not conducive to aiding misguided editors to become more amenable and productive. See also the section preceding this one. There is nothing to lose, and much to be gained, by a rename. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:35, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
- @Bagumba:. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:37, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
- Oppose move - Common guys, let's not squeeze all the juice out of the place in our attempt to be PC. It's a colorful metaphor, not an invitation to a hanging. (And, BTW, in the history of the world there have been far more legal hangings then there have been illegal lychings. For centuries hanging was the normal way of carrying out a legal death sentence.) BMK (talk) 16:48, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
- Support move and rewrite. The essay and article name are easily misunderstood, and wording in suicide metaphers is hardly civil, not even funny. On top of moving, it should also been used less. (I have seen one editor made unhappy by the usage, which is one too many.) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:50, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
- Oppose move for the same reason as I opposed the deletion, just because you don't like it doesn't means it must change. I'd also like to point out that only counts when the person wants it. Hell in a Bucket (talk) 16:52, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
- Do hold it against me for cursing while under distress. You're a disgusting individual. Alakzi (talk) 17:30, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
- Oppose move: My comment at the MfD are still mostly relevant. If this essay is being used to advocate for suicide, that's disgusting. But it also isn't a reason to throw the baby out with the bathwater. This essay is a colorful adage with a good teaching behind it. If the essay is being misused, that's a reflection of the user who misuses it, not necessarily on the essay itself. --ceradon (talk • edits) 16:53, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
- You're an involved admin. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 17:21, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
- @Pigsonthewing: And....? --ceradon (talk • edits) 17:22, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
- You're an involved admin. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 17:21, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
- Oppose move And all other attempts to turn this into a histrionic, handwringing, wishy-washy essay. I had taken this off my watchlist because it had been stable for so long and was widely cited in discussions, I figured it was off on its own now and would remain stable, but apparently we have to now re-write so that people who don't understand what a metaphor is won't be scared by it and think we are actually going to cause them to be hanged. I'd rather see it deleted than see any of that happen. If you want an essay that says soemthing other than what this one is says, write it already. Add it to the "see also" section on this essay if you like, but don't destroy this oft-cited essay just because you don't persoanlyl happen to like it. Beeblebrox (talk) 17:28, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
Recent edits
At the same time as the move suggested above, my recent edits, taking into account the new name, and which were summarily reverted (with edit summaries of "undiscussed move" and " pre-crusade version"), should be restored. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:41, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
Removals and Additions
Editing the article to a POV status doesn't help the case, hyperbole that this advocates suicide with dubious references just makes it look flimsy and reaching. Also when removing long standing content merely on the basis you don't like it needs a consensus when challenged. Hell in a Bucket (talk) 17:24, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
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