Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 21:22, 11 August 2006

Syntax

{{National football team |
  Name               = England |
  Badge              = England crest.png |
  Badge_size         = 120px |
  Nickname           = The Lions |
  Association        = ] |
  Coach              = ], ]- |
  Captain            = ] |
  Most caps          = ] (125) |
  Top scorer         = ] (49) |
  FIFA Trigramme     = ENG |
  FIFA Rank          = 5 |
  Elo Rank           = 5 |
  pattern_la1=|pattern_b1=|pattern_ra1=|
  leftarm1=FFFFFF|body1=FFFFFF|rightarm1=FFFFFF|shorts1=000099|socks1=FFFFFF|
  pattern_la2=|pattern_b2=|pattern_ra2=|
  leftarm2=FF0000|body2=FF0000|rightarm2=FF0000|shorts2=FFFFFF|socks2=FF0000|
  First game         = ] 0 - 0 England<br />(], ]; ], ]) |
  Largest win        = ] 0 - 13 England<br/>(], ]; ], ]) |
  Largest loss       = ] 7 - 1 England<br/>(], ]; ], ]) |
  World cup apps     = 11  |
  World cup first    = 1950 |
  World cup best     = Winners, ] |
  Regional name      = ] |
  Regional cup apps  = 7 |
  Regional cup first = ]|
  Regional cup best  = Third, ], Semi-finals, ] 
}}

For football kit template instructions, see Template talk:Football kit.

Optional fields are: Captain, World cup apps, World cup first, World cup best, Regional name, Regional cup apps, Regional cup first and Regional cup best.

Suggestions

First of all, great job on the infobox, Ed g2s!

I have a few suggestions to improve the infobox:

• A box for the shirt badge
• Use the {{PAGENAME}} template instead of the {{{Name}}} parameter
• Highlight World Cup and European Championship (regional cup) for easier understanding.

Here's an example -->

England national football team

Image:England crest.png
Nickname	The Lions
Association	The FA
Coach	Sven-Göran Eriksson, 2001-
Captain	David Beckham
Most caps	Peter Shilton (125)
Top scorer	Bobby Charlton (49)
Home colours Away colours
First International Scotland 0 - 0 England (Partick, Scotland; 30 November, 1872)
Largest win Ireland 0 - 13 England (Belfast, Northern Ireland; 18 February, 1882)
Largest defeat Hungary 7 - 1 England (Budapest, Hungary; 23 May, 1954)
World Cup
Appearances	11 (First in 1950)
Best result	Winners, 1966
European Championship
Appearances	7 (First in 1968)
Best result	Third, 1968, Semi-finals, 1996

Keep up the good work! - DragonFire 19:28, 16 Nov 2004 (UTC)

With regards to your points:

• I am converting the JPG badges to transparent PNGs on each implementation, http://www.brandsoftheworld.com have a quite a few relevant .eps files.
• {{PAGENAME}} should always be avoided, as pages can be moved and disambiguated (e.g. "Australian national football/soccer") team etc. Although it's probably not going to have much of an effect here, it's bad practice. We already know we're talking about national teams, so "England" suffices as a caption. For countries with longer names, this is going to make the box unnecessarily wide.
• I'm always reluctant to put in custom colours, hence the use of id="toc" which is set by the user's monobook.css / skin selection.

ed g2s • talk 15:43, 18 Nov 2004 (UTC)

How about an optional line for the captain? In many if not all cases it's clear, and the captain often outlasts several managers. -- Pellucidity 05:51, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

I think that an optional captain line is needed as well and since I've noticed nobody's against it I've added it to the template as optional and added it to a few national teams' pages. Yonatanh 03:03, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

Small problem

Look at Latvia national football team, the World Cup section. Since Latvia has never been in any WC, putting a "-" for "World cup first" gives us a wiki to Football_World_Cup_-. Leaving it blank is even worse. --Dryazan 14:12, 17 Nov 2004 (UTC)

This could be easily solved by making the world cup appearences optional parameters. --Bob 17:41, 2 May 2006 (UTC)

Italics on nickname

Ed, I've been going through all teams, making italics on nickname consistent everywhere -- the name in the original language is italic and the English translation, if any, is not: Les Fennecs<br>(The Desert Foxes). If there's only one name, it's italicized: The Lions. I guess the reverse is ok too, but I just spent 20 minutes cleaning this up. Please don't reverse it unless you think it's really necessary. --Dryazan 14:53, 23 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Tweak for women's teams

I have a suggestion regarding women's teams.

Create a separate template for women's teams, identical to the one for men, but with one exception—an added section for Olympics appearances and results. Reason: In the women's game, the Olympic tournament is every bit as prestigious as the World Cup (most definitely NOT the case for men). While the men's Olympic tournament is limited to players under 23 (with three overage players per squad allowed), the women's tournament is contested between full national sides with no age restrictions.

A suggested name for the template: "National football team women"

Any comments? Dale Arnett 21:45, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Support --Monkbel 20:36, 11 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Done. Dale Arnett 18:48, 16 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Suggestion - Add a section for Confederations Cup appearances, best results

For a few teams, the Confederations Cup is possibly worth another few lines at the bottom of the box, though as an optional set of parameters. --Richardb43 09:47, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

added changble badge size

hey there,, I added a changble badge size in the thing to remove the size lock and streaching is some teams --mo-- ( | _#info | ) 22:23, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

Trigramme

Is there really a need for this? Yonatanh 01:51, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

Spelling of colour/color

There is a discussion on Talk:United States men's national soccer team about the different spellings of color. On US-interest pages the spelling should correctly be "color" but on UK-interest pages it should be "colour". This cannot be done without substituting the infobox into the page and changing the code. So, I suggest we change "Home colours" to "Home kit". It's less controversial and also, IMO, more correct. -- Boothman _/tɔːk/ 09:43, 7 July 2006 (UTC).

2nd Region for Australia

Since Template:AUSf is now in the AFC, there needs to be two spots for region, one for the OFC and one for the AFC. is there a way to da that?--Jaysscholar 14:33, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

It would be a real mess. If/when Australia will win an AFC cup, you can just add the year and "(AFC)", or add "(OFC)" to the previous victories.--Semioli 16:28, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

Survey

Hello.

As regards the use of kits in the infobox, I would like to know your opinion about wheter:

1. they should depict as close as possible to reality the current kits
2. they should depict the colours and styles (stripes, dots, decorations) of the national teams, without reproducing each design in the particulars.

To make an example, if you think that the Italian jersey should show the black swirls, or the Ukrainian jersey should be decorated with blue radial stripes, you are supporting the first option; if you think the Italian jersey should be plain blue, and the Ukrainian one should be yellow with blue borders, you are leaning towards the second option. --Spunti 16:26, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

I think they should depict the colours and styles (2nd option). If people try to recreate the kit exactly then it you could end up with amateurish replicas. I think collars and trim is as far as it should go IMO. -- Boothman _/tɔːk/ 17:27, 11 August 2006 (UTC).

They should be somewhere in between. However, they should be as factual as possible, without going down to the nitty gritty. They don't have to be exact replicas (they can and should be if its necessary!!), although I do not see a reason for them not to be. Lemme offer some examples where what you said is true and when it isn't:

to is acceptable and in fact good for Misplaced Pages. That design is purely aesthetic design.

to is bad. The edited jersey looks silly without the designs and the designs are critical to linking the German NT to its jersey.

to is bad in two ways. 1st, it is factually incorrect. The Ukraine NT has never used that shade of blue. 2nd, Ukraine's jersey design has never stayed the same, and unlike a lot of traditional countries such as Italy, England etc, they do not have a specific set of colors that their jersey will match year after year. It is in my opinion that in this case, the latest jersey is most accceptable to the team page. --Palffy 17:47, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

The spikes of the current Ukraina jersey are not spikes of Ukraina but spikes of Lotto, since also other teams using Lotto have the same design.

The decoration of German jersey is not typical German, but a decoration of all Adidas jersey.

National team kits exist beyond fashion.--Kwame Nkrumah 18:59, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

I'm aware that those are standard Lotto and Adidas designs of the two respective jerseys. However, when you're displaying factually wrong information (as is the case with the Ukrainian jersey) and something that doesn't really resemble the German jersey, the issue should be compromised. Btw, here are all of the jersey designs of Ukraine, and . The designs change year after year, but none of those are what you have proposed. Also, please stick to one username, since I'm still convinced that you, Kwame Nkrumah, and you, Spunti, are the same person. --Palffy 19:07, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

The Ukraina nft jersey has been consistently yellow with blue inserts. The blue spikes are by Lotto.

And, please, note that how I am avoiding to answer your personal comment with another comment on what I think about you.--Kwame Nkrumah 19:11, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

The shoulders are usually blue, and they're certainly not the same blue that you used. Why don't you let me know what you think about me?.. =) —Palffy 19:29, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Change the shade of blue, if you like. The problem is the pattern, not the shade of blue.--Kwame Nkrumah 19:34, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

I think the pattern is also a problem. If you come up with a more appropriate pattern where the shoulder design is the right shade of blue and an appropriate historical pattern of the jersey, I will accept it. --Palffy 20:02, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

I think it should looks as close as possible to the actually jersey while still not looking silly, it this case the one I want to stay does not look silly and it looks good. -- Je suis _t\ 18:46, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

The problem of your solution is that cannot be enforeced. Who decides what is silly? A user took time to design this Bulgarian kit because (s)he thought it was not silly and very close to actual jersey.--Kwame Nkrumah 18:59, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

I'm not 100% sure if the reproduction of manufacturer's designs is allowed under copyright law. There are a certain few symbols and designs that are protected, but a lot that aren't, or cannot be. However, the most accurate representation of the kit is surely the best. Failing that, I would accept a kit reduced in detail to its most basic elements (eg plain white for Germany, B&W stripes for Juventus, Red body & white sleeves for Arsenal).

Last season Arsenal used an all dark-red shirt, which appeared in the infobox, but the red & white shirt was included elsewhere on the page as a representation of their traditional colours. Barcelona this season will have red & blue halves but their traditional format is in stripes, so I would recommend that the striped version appear elsewhere on the page.

What I will not accept is a misinformative representation of a kit. Ukraine have had several very different designs over their decade of international football but one constant has been the yellow shirt and blue shorts, so if someone (or his sockpuppet) starts adding blue cuffs (which don't appear on the current kit) I would most likely object.  Slumgum T. C.   19:49, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

The blue borders stand for theblue inserts which always have been present on UA nft jerseys.--Kwame Nkrumah 19:55, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Look, I think if you're intent on not having commercial representation of these jerseys, then I think you should come up with a better example of a UNT and German NT jersey on a test page and present it here. I think we are willing contributors and would be glad to compromise on some aspects. The problem that we're all having is that it's factually false and is not representative of their jerseys in any way. --Palffy 20:15, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Is Bugaria nft jersey "factually false"? Yes, jet you said it was good to remove it. Now, why Ukrainian jersey is different?--Kwame Nkrumah 20:30, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Read my reasons again. Read Slumgum's response carefully. Let me also introduce you to, , it's a fascinating concept. --Palffy 20:34, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Your concept of compromise translates into "I do whatever I want, the others should prove me wrong". Oh, and thanks for your

What are you talking about? I agree with you that these can be subject to change if you wanted to do. However, what you change it to must be reasonable. What don't you understand about presenting false information on Misplaced Pages? --Palffy 20:51, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

If you like the Bulgarian design to go away, it can go, but if you don't like the Lotto design to go away, the burden of creating a test page and convince you goes to the others. And note that I am still avoiding answering your provocations (i.e. introducing you to a couple of words). Even more, if some compromises are not of your taste, you revert them, right? (hint )--Kwame Nkrumah 20:57, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

No, because people appear to be content with the current jersey. It is you who is intent on changing them. I feel that I have done my part in the compromise and I will gladly help you with your selection once you create a test page for it (because otherwise I'm ok with the current status of the page). There is no compromise on the example you presented because your evidence is "this official website says so" and my evidence is that "the official language of Ukraine is Ukrainian, the official names of all clubs in Ukraine are in Ukrainian, Uefa sanctions the clubs as Chornomorets, not Chernomorets". Judging from your posts on the subject matter, you have 0 expertise as Slumgum suggested, something that I would agree on him with. --Palffy 21:02, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Looks like our positions are not conciliable. We shall see the end of this survey.--Kwame Nkrumah 21:06, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Why don't you show this to an administrator and see who he or she thinks is more conciliable. --Palffy 21:20, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Because I could be accused of "harassing" you, maybe.--Kwame Nkrumah 21:22, 11 August 2006 (UTC)