User talk:YBG: Difference between revisions

Browse history interactively ← Previous edit Next edit →Content deleted Content addedVisual WikitextInline

Revision as of 08:50, 9 May 2016 editYBG (talk \| contribs)Extended confirmed users15,549 edits →top: Deleting comment refactored to →May 2016 ← Previous edit		Revision as of 10:43, 9 May 2016 edit undoGolfeditor1 (talk \| contribs)129 edits →May 2016: responseTags: Mobile edit Mobile web editNext edit →
Line 1,766:		Line 1,766:

	My response is at {{sectionlink\|user talk:Golfeditor1\|May 2016}}. ] (]) 08:49, 9 May 2016 (UTC)		My response is at {{sectionlink\|user talk:Golfeditor1\|May 2016}}. ] (]) 08:49, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

			Hello YBG,

			thank you.

			I understand your points, however it shouldn't require my publicly (and forever) publishing a copy of my ID and passport to substantiate points that require attention.

			...when various personal information and links are wrong, then it should be self-evident to the editor in question.

			I am not prepared to publish my identification documents.

			Furthermore, in context of the comparisons you made, wrong portrayals can be deemed slanderous and pursued by litigation. If I were a politician or high-profiler that would be a certainty.

			Regards
			Lincoln

Revision as of 10:43, 9 May 2016

This is YBG's talk page, where you can send him messages and comments.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Misplaced Pages? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Archives: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6

Welcome

Hello, YBG! Welcome to Misplaced Pages! Thank you for your contributions. You may benefit from following some of the links below, which will help you get the most out of Misplaced Pages. If you have any questions you can ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and ask your question there. Please remember to sign your name on talk pages by clicking

or by typing four tildes "~~~~"; this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you are already loving Misplaced Pages you might want to consider being "adopted" by a more experienced editor or joining a WikiProject to collaborate with others in creating and improving articles of your interest. Click here for a directory of all the WikiProjects. Finally, please do your best to always fill in the edit summary field. Happy editing! Sting Buzz Me... 12:59, 15 November 2008 (UTC)

Getting Started
Misplaced Pages Tutorial • The five pillars of Misplaced Pages How to: edit a page • upload an image
Getting Help
Frequently Asked Questions Where to ask questions or make comments Request administrator attention
Policies and Guidelines
Neutral point of view • Reliable sources Verifiability • Citing sources • No original research What Misplaced Pages is not • Biographies of living persons Manual of Style • Three-revert rule • Sock puppetry Copyrights • Policy for non-free content • Image use policy External links • Spam • Vandalism Deletion policy • Conflict of interest • Notability

The Community
Community Portal • Adopt-a-user program Assume good faith • Civility • Etiquette No personal attacks • Resolving disputes Build consensus • Village pump Signpost • IRC channels • Mailing lists
Things to do
Be bold in editing • Help develop an article Pages needing attention • Peer review Join a WikiProject • Translating articles Cleaning up: General • Spam • Vandalism
Miscellaneous
Categories • Disambiguity • Stubs User pages • Talk pages Useful templates • Tools • User scripts

Wiki etiquette

Thanks! for being so polite while I was stumbling around in Marmite.
TheSeven (talk) 19:35, 28 November 2008 (UTC)

Hi

Hi YBG, thanks for sharing your thoughts in our discussion on WikiProject Oregon. I guess our work is getting broad enough, that I'm sorry to say your work had not really caught my attention yet…but I see you've been working in a number of areas of Oregon content. Thanks! You said you've been keeping an eye on our project for a while…I hope you decide to join us more formally at some point! Also, thanks for the additional bot suggestion; it's a good idea. -Pete (talk) 15:49, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

You are invited to join WikiProject Oregon, a WikiProject dedicated to improving articles related to the U.S. state of Oregon .

You received this invitation because of your history editing Oregon articles or discussion of Oregon topics. The Oregon WikiProject group discussion is here.
If you are interested in joining, please visit the project page, and add your name to the list of participants. New members may read about existing members and introduce themselves here.

Notes to myself

Completed
Y I'm thinking of modifing the table in UO-OSU Scores to be a bit more concise and readable, one decade per line. Completed here on Aug 20th, 2009 YBG (talk) 05:42, 24 August 2009 (UTC) Also WSU/UW results on Sep. 2 YBG (talk) 06:41, 6 September 2009 (UTC) Y Create Doug Baker (disambiguation). YBG (talk) 06:41, 6 September 2009 (UTC) Done YBG (talk) 08:51, 10 September 2009 (UTC) Y Add disambig page for $1, $2 and maybe others. YBG (talk) 06:41, 6 September 2009 (UTC) Added to existing page Sep 11 03:47, 03:50 YBG (talk) 03:51, 25 September 2009 (UTC) Y Add refs to List of National Football League retired numbers per nfl.com. YBG (talk) 08:16, 14 October 2009 (UTC) Done today. YBG (talk) 05:36, 22 October 2009 (UTC) Y FL of Oregon symbols: Move 'Description' column to end, left-justify its prose text and top-align all cells, resulting in a visually appealing arrangement with generally triangular content areas and white space. YBG (talk) 07:57, 16 November 2009 (UTC) Suggestion made YBG (talk) 08:50, 17 November 2009 (UTC) Y Fix TriMet's renamed Fareless Square YBG (talk) 22:13, 7 November 2009 (UTC) Others have already done this YBG (talk) 04:07, 18 January 2010 (UTC) Y Check recent edits of NFL Retired No', cf nfl.com YBG (talk) 06:34, 30 March 2010 (UTC) Done, adding <Ref>/{{cn}} to facilitate future checks. YBG (talk) 07:42, 20 April 2010 (UTC) Y Fix sorting on List of Interstate Highways as done in here YBG (talk) 04:20, 18 January 2010 (UTC) Done YBG (talk) 06:45, 11 May 2010 (UTC) ~~Add sort by number of associated routes YBG (talk) 06:45, 11 May 2010 (UTC)~~ Or maybe sort by number of states served YBG (talk) 06:23, 15 May 2010 (UTC) Done YBG (talk) 05:56, 1 June 2010 (UTC) Y Fix per Talk:Index of U.S. counties#Abbreviate states YBG (talk) 05:04, 18 September 2010 (UTC) done YBG (talk) 07:03, 7 July 2011 (UTC) Thinking about undoing this change at the request of one non-US reader. YBG (talk) 08:51, 13 August 2011 (UTC) Y Add to List of former US counties per MacArthur. YBG (talk) 06:04, 7 July 2011 (UTC) Done here and here last week. YBG (talk) 07:07, 17 September 2011 (UTC) r Merger proposal for Cross Keys and Crossed keys. YBG (talk) 05:09, 21 February 2012 (UTC) √ 03:31, 12 March 2012 (UTC) N Change N.W.F.P. and NWFP to KPK where not anachronistic. YBG (talk) 13:08, 12 January 2012 (UTC) N Validate change to Rahul, check multiple meanings. YBG (talk) 06:31, 30 November 2011 (UTC) N Fix sorting problem in List of elements YBG (talk) 01:15, 18 October 2011 (UTC) Seems OK on IE8 and IE9, but maybe not on other browsers YBG (talk) 12:36, 30 November 2011 (UTC) Y Weigh in on Talk:U.S._state#Merge_discussion YBG (talk) 23:45, 14 May 2011 (UTC) Done YBG (talk) 05:48, 1 December 2011 (UTC) Y Combine two tables in List of U.S. states by coastline YBG (talk) 23:40, 14 May 2011 (UTC) √ Done YBG (talk) 07:29, 1 December 2011 (UTC) N Fix per Talk:List_of_Interstate_Highways#Major Errors YBG (talk) 03:31, 27 December 2010 (UTC) N Fix per Talk:Christian#Definition YBG (talk) 05:04, 18 September 2010 (UTC) Maybe not YBG (talk) 07:14, 6 October 2011 (UTC) Remove #-links from these dab pages YBG (talk) 07:18, 22 January 2013 (UTC) Y ETA (disambiguation) YBG (talk) 22:00, 26 January 2013 (UTC) Y Fifth Quarter YBG (talk) 22:00, 26 January 2013 (UTC) Y W2 YBG (talk) 22:00, 26 January 2013 (UTC) N Is the correct style for non-reference notes used here YBG (talk) 16:25, 25 April 2010 (UTC) The text between the note-mark and note-text had been eliminated, so I considered combining them together. But the note didn't seem to pertain to the section any more, or even to the article, so I eliminated it entirely. YBG (talk) 13:30, 7 March 2013 (UTC) Y What happened to the "Cite" button that I found so helpful for entering references? I referred to it here, but it seems to have disappeared. YBG (talk) 15:52, 10 March 2013 (UTC) Not sure why, but I see it now. 04:05, 12 January 2015 (UTC) Y Restructure List of U.S. counties that share names with U.S. states as a table. YBG (talk) 05:58, 14 March 2013 (UTC) √ done YBG (talk) 04:52, 10 June 2013 (UTC) N Figure out how to mark inaccurate translations; apply to List of U.S. state abbreviations, e.g., I tried to delete some here but most were promptly reverted. YBG (talk) 05:21, 28 April 2012 (UTC) Now a part of wikidata YBG (talk) 08:13, 3 March 2013 (UTC) Y Fix State abbreviation sorting by status YBG (talk) 00:51, 12 June 2010 (UTC) Now included as a separate column in the table. YBG (talk) 01:02, 14 September 2012 (UTC)

Completed

Y I'm thinking of modifing the table in UO-OSU Scores to be a bit more concise and readable, one decade per line.
- Completed here on Aug 20th, 2009 YBG (talk) 05:42, 24 August 2009 (UTC)
- Also WSU/UW results on Sep. 2 YBG (talk) 06:41, 6 September 2009 (UTC)
Y Create Doug Baker (disambiguation). YBG (talk) 06:41, 6 September 2009 (UTC)
- Done YBG (talk) 08:51, 10 September 2009 (UTC)
Y Add disambig page for $1, $2 and maybe others. YBG (talk) 06:41, 6 September 2009 (UTC)
- Added to existing page Sep 11 03:47, 03:50 YBG (talk) 03:51, 25 September 2009 (UTC)
Y Add refs to List of National Football League retired numbers per nfl.com. YBG (talk) 08:16, 14 October 2009 (UTC)
- Done today. YBG (talk) 05:36, 22 October 2009 (UTC)
Y FL of Oregon symbols: Move 'Description' column to end, left-justify its prose text and top-align all cells, resulting in a visually appealing arrangement with generally triangular content areas and white space. YBG (talk) 07:57, 16 November 2009 (UTC)
- Suggestion made YBG (talk) 08:50, 17 November 2009 (UTC)
Y Fix TriMet's renamed Fareless Square YBG (talk) 22:13, 7 November 2009 (UTC)
- Others have already done this YBG (talk) 04:07, 18 January 2010 (UTC)
Y Check recent edits of NFL Retired No', cf nfl.com YBG (talk) 06:34, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
- Done, adding <Ref>/{{cn}} to facilitate future checks. YBG (talk) 07:42, 20 April 2010 (UTC)
Y Fix sorting on List of Interstate Highways as done in here YBG (talk) 04:20, 18 January 2010 (UTC)
- Done YBG (talk) 06:45, 11 May 2010 (UTC)
- ~~Add sort by number of associated routes YBG (talk) 06:45, 11 May 2010 (UTC)~~
- Or maybe sort by number of states served YBG (talk) 06:23, 15 May 2010 (UTC)
  - Done YBG (talk) 05:56, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
Y Fix per Talk:Index of U.S. counties#Abbreviate states YBG (talk) 05:04, 18 September 2010 (UTC)
- done YBG (talk) 07:03, 7 July 2011 (UTC)
- Thinking about undoing this change at the request of one non-US reader. YBG (talk) 08:51, 13 August 2011 (UTC)
Y Add to List of former US counties per MacArthur. YBG (talk) 06:04, 7 July 2011 (UTC)
- Done here and here last week. YBG (talk) 07:07, 17 September 2011 (UTC)
r Merger proposal for Cross Keys and Crossed keys. YBG (talk) 05:09, 21 February 2012 (UTC) √ 03:31, 12 March 2012 (UTC)
N Change N.W.F.P. and NWFP to KPK where not anachronistic. YBG (talk) 13:08, 12 January 2012 (UTC)
N Validate change to Rahul, check multiple meanings. YBG (talk) 06:31, 30 November 2011 (UTC)
N Fix sorting problem in List of elements YBG (talk) 01:15, 18 October 2011 (UTC)
- Seems OK on IE8 and IE9, but maybe not on other browsers YBG (talk) 12:36, 30 November 2011 (UTC)
Y Weigh in on Talk:U.S._state#Merge_discussion YBG (talk) 23:45, 14 May 2011 (UTC) Done YBG (talk) 05:48, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
Y Combine two tables in List of U.S. states by coastline YBG (talk) 23:40, 14 May 2011 (UTC) √ Done YBG (talk) 07:29, 1 December 2011 (UTC)
N Fix per Talk:List_of_Interstate_Highways#Major Errors YBG (talk) 03:31, 27 December 2010 (UTC)
N Fix per Talk:Christian#Definition YBG (talk) 05:04, 18 September 2010 (UTC)
- Maybe not YBG (talk) 07:14, 6 October 2011 (UTC)
Remove #-links from these dab pages YBG (talk) 07:18, 22 January 2013 (UTC)
- Y ETA (disambiguation) YBG (talk) 22:00, 26 January 2013 (UTC)
- Y Fifth Quarter YBG (talk) 22:00, 26 January 2013 (UTC)
- Y W2 YBG (talk) 22:00, 26 January 2013 (UTC)
N Is the correct style for non-reference notes used here YBG (talk) 16:25, 25 April 2010 (UTC)
- The text between the note-mark and note-text had been eliminated, so I considered combining them together. But the note didn't seem to pertain to the section any more, or even to the article, so I eliminated it entirely. YBG (talk) 13:30, 7 March 2013 (UTC)
Y What happened to the "Cite" button that I found so helpful for entering references? I referred to it here, but it seems to have disappeared. YBG (talk) 15:52, 10 March 2013 (UTC)
- Not sure why, but I see it now. 04:05, 12 January 2015 (UTC)
Y Restructure List of U.S. counties that share names with U.S. states as a table. YBG (talk) 05:58, 14 March 2013 (UTC) √ done YBG (talk) 04:52, 10 June 2013 (UTC)
N Figure out how to mark inaccurate translations; apply to List of U.S. state abbreviations, e.g.,
- I tried to delete some here but most were promptly reverted. YBG (talk) 05:21, 28 April 2012 (UTC)
- Now a part of wikidata YBG (talk) 08:13, 3 March 2013 (UTC)
Y Fix State abbreviation sorting by status YBG (talk) 00:51, 12 June 2010 (UTC)
- Now included as a separate column in the table. YBG (talk) 01:02, 14 September 2012 (UTC)

Incomplete or recently complete

Organize templates for National Anthems of Asia, the world, &c. YBG (talk) 23:43, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
Modify Languages of template to auto-remove '(s)' YBG (talk) 23:10, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
Reorganize Languages of Pakistan article YBG (talk) 02:27, 5 September 2009 (UTC)
Is there a template to color maps of the US by state? YBG (talk)
Add total to lead in US county name list YBG (talk) 04:03, 25 September 2009 (UTC)
Hunt for info re VC rest areas on Federal Highway YBG (talk) 22:30, 7 November 2009 (UTC)
Respond re photos in WT:WikiProject Oregon/Archive 12#Portland State Office Building YBG (talk) 01:48, 1 January 2010 (UTC)
Add County column on OR canal lists (A-L) & (M-Z) YBG (talk) 06:31, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
- Done here and here this week. YBG (talk) 05:09, 2 November 2011 (UTC)
  - But this may not be the right thing to do as some are in multiple counties
- Consider refactoring lists into Eastern & Western Oregon; alpha lists don't make much sense.
Dates might be helpful in Superseded scientific theories YBG (talk) 14:04, 25 January 2012 (UTC)
Reorganize Period articles YBG (talk) 02:37, 10 October 2012 (UTC)

Portland demographics

This section formerly had a number of alternatives that I eventually moved to Talk:Portland,_Oregon#Demography_.26_Race and then expanded and archived.

Useful WP stuff

This is a collection of useful wikipedia forms.

More syntax

Item 1
Item 2

{{collapse top|Collapsed text}}collapsed text{{collpse bottom}}

Collapsed text
collapsed text

Style

Do not use lists if a passage reads easily using plain paragraphs. WP:MOS#Bulleted and numbered lists
Use straight quotes and apostrophes, not the curly typographic form. WP:MOS#Quotation characters 03:05, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Interesting WP articles

Collective names of groups of like elements

Misplaced Pages:Featured list candidates/List of Oregon state symbols/archive1

Hi, are you satisfied with the revisions made, or do you still have any issues with the list? Dabomb87 (talk) 15:08, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

I just made some more tweaks and commented on the FL nomination page. YBG (talk) 07:28, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

PSOB reminder..

I posted a bunch of pics of the Portland State Office Building symbols for you- haven't seen a reply. tedder (talk) 06:29, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

Thanks...

...for redoing that trivia section on Willamette Stone. It's not trivial anymore, and I added another reference and a link to 1959 photos of the stone. Drmies (talk) 15:37, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

Re Template:Adelaide CBD Streets

I probably do have them the wrong way round. For some reason I cannot seem to remember which is which. I agree with you anyway. Pleased to see you experimenting. Donama (talk) 09:36, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

Yes, I noticed. Nice one. Donama (talk) 22:31, 8 December 2011 (UTC)

NFL retired numbers

Thank you for the recognition!! I had realised that the main nfl reference cited in the article no longer works; in fact, I replaced that link for another source which lists all the numbers and players honored. This was because the retired jerseys section was supressed from the NFL.com site, I don´t know why. I will continue adding sources as much as I can, thanks ! Fma12 (talk) 02:24, 6 December 2011 (UTC)

Talkback

"Ignoble non-metals of the world, unite"

They already did. The result is called life. :-) Double sharp (talk) 16:21, 11 September 2012 (UTC)

You're Invited to Misplaced Pages Loves Libraries 2012 (Portland, Oregon)!

	<font=3>WIKIPEDIA LOVES LIBRARIES: MULTNOMAH COUNTY EDIT-ATHON! You're invited to participate in Misplaced Pages Loves Libraries 2012, an edit-athon hosted by Multnomah County Library for the purpose of improving stubs relating to Multnomah County. The event will take place on Saturday, October 27, 2012 from 2:00-4:00pm at the Central Library in downtown Portland. You can view details about this Wiki Loves Libraries event here. Be sure to RSVP and share the results of your work HERE. Click here for more information about meetups in Portland! --Another Believer _(Talk) 21:27, 3 October 2012 (UTC)

<font=3>WIKIPEDIA LOVES LIBRARIES: MULTNOMAH COUNTY EDIT-ATHON!
You're invited to participate in Misplaced Pages Loves Libraries 2012, an edit-athon hosted by Multnomah County Library for the purpose of improving stubs relating to Multnomah County. The event will take place on Saturday, October 27, 2012 from 2:00-4:00pm at the Central Library in downtown Portland. You can view details about this Wiki Loves Libraries event here. Be sure to RSVP and share the results of your work HERE.
Click here for more information about meetups in Portland! --Another Believer _(Talk) 21:27, 3 October 2012 (UTC)

Sounds great, but I don't think I'll be able to make it. YBG (talk) 23:45, 3 October 2012 (UTC)

Ununpentium (fictional element)

Hi thanks for your suggestions before. As you have being involved, your opinions also would be appreciated over there. Also I´d like to suggest a quick look in the summaries of the article. Please see Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Element 115 in popular culture. Eka-bismuth (talk) 21:28, 4 November 2012 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages edit-thon: Saturday, February 9, 2013

	WIKIPEDIA EDIT-ATHON! You're invited to the upcoming Misplaced Pages edit-athon, scheduled for Saturday, February 9 from 2–5pm in Old Town. Sponsored by Wiki Strategies and Prichard Communications, the event will begin with an introduction to Misplaced Pages, followed by an edit-a-thon focused on Portland's food scene, all things that "Keep Portland Weird", and local startup businesses. Details and signup here!

WIKIPEDIA EDIT-ATHON!
You're invited to the upcoming Misplaced Pages edit-athon, scheduled for Saturday, February 9 from 2–5pm in Old Town. Sponsored by Wiki Strategies and Prichard Communications, the event will begin with an introduction to Misplaced Pages, followed by an edit-a-thon focused on Portland's food scene, all things that "Keep Portland Weird", and local startup businesses.
Details and signup here!

Hope to see you there! --Another Believer _(Talk) 16:47, 16 January 2013 (UTC)

SuggestBot Request

Articles you might like to edit, from SuggestBot

SuggestBot predicts that you will enjoy editing some of these articles. Have fun!

Stubs: State law (United States); West Salem High School (Salem, Oregon); National Association for College Admission Counseling; John Rundle; Comberbach; Datagram socket; Chikhaldara; Republic of Canada; 1970 United States Census; Badnera; Raipur, Uttarakhand; 1960 United States Census; North American Saxophone Alliance; R. B. McCallum; Flag of Nevada; Pratitnagar; List of execution chambers in the United States; Government College of Engineering, Amravati; Veerbhadra

Cleanup: Parole board; Sarah Jane Brain Foundation State Lead Centers of Excellence; Mobile Allocation Index Offset
Merge: Extreme points of Massachusetts; Historic regions of the United States; Fundamentalist–Modernist Controversy
Add Sources: List of database subscriptions provided by US public libraries; Daryapur; Maharashtra
Wikify: Hinduism in Sri Lanka; Hemp; List of United States electric companies
Expand: Visitor center; Extreme points of U.S. states; Beaverton School District

SuggestBot picks articles in a number of ways based on other articles you've edited, including straight text similarity, following wikilinks, and matching your editing patterns against those of other Wikipedians. It tries to recommend only articles that other Wikipedians have marked as needing work. Your contributions make Misplaced Pages better — thanks for helping.

If you have feedback on how to make SuggestBot better, please tell me on SuggestBot's talk page. Thanks from Nettrom (talk), SuggestBot's caretaker. -- SuggestBot (talk) 07:21, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for April 22

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Misplaced Pages appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited List of parks in Portland, Oregon, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Vanport (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

It's OK to remove this message. Also, to stop receiving these messages, follow these opt-out instructions. Thanks, DPL bot (talk) 13:16, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Pix on the PCA

I think the article with pictures is more friendly, than the pure text only version. Why Briarwood Presbyterian for example? The PCA was formed there. It can be better imagine the whole story with the picture the place, the building where the PCA was created. If you have better pictures more suitable for the article please help to have a better article.Cryx88 Thanks your opinion.

Commas in numbers

(This is a draft; I'm not sure where to post it

On the MOS talk page -- but this avoids reaching a local consensus first
On the project talk pages -- but then India, Pakistan or both?

Should South Asian articles insert commas for thousands and millions (12,345,678) or for thousands, lakhs and crores (1,23,45,678)? MOS:COMMONALITY seems to lean to millions but MOS:TIES to lakhs/crores. MOS:TIES is quite explicit on the corresponding question about date formatting, but WP:NUMERAL doesn't seem to be as helpful. It seems to say that if commas are used for lakhs/crores, the first instance should include a parenthesized explanation commas for millions. This seems unhelpful, particularly for tables and infoboxes.

I am wondering if any South Asian projects (WP:Pakistan, WP:India, etc) have developed a project style that speaks to this. If not, I think it would be good to develop a consensus within these projects and then perhaps make the Manual of Style as explicit in this question as it is for dates.

Here are the relevant sections of from WP:MOS:

WP:Manual of Style#Opportunities for commonality (MOS:COMMONALITY)

'tens of millions' is preferable to crore (Indian English).

WP:Manual of Style#Strong national ties to a topic (MOS:TIES)

An article on a topic that has strong ties to a particular English-speaking nation should use the English of that nation.

WP:Manual of Style#Internal consistency (WP:CONSISTENCY)

While Misplaced Pages does not favor any national variety of English, within a given article the conventions of one particular variety should be followed consistently.

WP:Manual of Style/Dates and numbers#Strong national ties to a topic (MOS:TIES)

Articles on topics with strong ties to a particular English-speaking country should generally use the more common date format for that nation.

WP:Manual of Style/Dates and numbers#Numbers as figures or words (WP:NUMERAL)

Sometimes, the variety of English used in an article may call for the use of a numbering system other than the Western thousands-based system. For example, the South Asian numbering system is conventionally used in South Asian English. In those situations, link the first spelled-out instance of each quantity (e.g. ], which yields crore). (If no instances are spelled out, provide a note after the first instance directing the reader to the article about the numbering system.) Also, provide a conversion to Western numbers for the first instance of each quantity, and provide conversions for subsequent instances if they do not overwhelm the content of the article. For example, write three crore (thirty million). Similarly, if you write 3,00,00,000, also write (30,000,000) or (30000000). (Note that the variety of English does not uniquely determine the method of numbering in an article. Other considerations, such as conventions used in mathematics, science and engineering, may also apply, and the choice and order of formats and conversions is a matter of editorial discretion and consensus.)

WP:Manual of Style/Dates and numbers#Delimiting (grouping of digits)

Numbers with five or more digits to the left of the decimal point (i.e. 10,000 or greater) should be delimited into groups so they can be easily parsed, such as by using a comma (,) every three digits (e.g. 12,200, 255,200, 8,274,527). A full stop (.) should not be used to separate thousands (e.g. 12.200, 255.200) to avoid confusion with the decimal point.
The style of delimiting numbers must be consistent throughout an article.

I plan to invite members of those projects to contribute to this discussion. YBG (talk) 00:59, 1 June 2013 (UTC)

Portland "Wiknic" 2013!

	"WIKNIC" 2013! You're invited to the upcoming "Wiknic", scheduled for Saturday, June 22. In typical Misplaced Pages fashion, you can help decide the location. Details and signup here!

Hope you are able to attend! --Another Believer _(Talk) 22:51, 11 June 2013 (UTC)

I went through your comments on F

Probably need you to go through again after I get it cleaned up as there is some evolution.TCO (talk) 03:40, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

Thanks man

Edits look great. Very smooth.TCO (talk) 05:24, 13 June 2013 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for July 10

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Misplaced Pages appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited Akola, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Economic Times (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

It's OK to remove this message. Also, to stop receiving these messages, follow these opt-out instructions. Thanks, DPL bot (talk) 11:13, 10 July 2013 (UTC)

Wiki Takes PDX 2013!

	WIKIPEDIA TAKES PORTLAND 2013! You're invited to participate in the upcoming "Misplaced Pages Takes Portland" campaign, to be held during the month of September. The local campaign occurs annually in conjunction with Misplaced Pages Takes America and Wiki Loves Monuments in the United States. Photographing sites included on the National Register of Historic Places (NRHP) is the main focus of Misplaced Pages Takes Portland. In typical Misplaced Pages fashion, you can work individually or create a team. Details and signup here!

WIKIPEDIA TAKES PORTLAND 2013!
You're invited to participate in the upcoming "Misplaced Pages Takes Portland" campaign, to be held during the month of September. The local campaign occurs annually in conjunction with Misplaced Pages Takes America and Wiki Loves Monuments in the United States. Photographing sites included on the National Register of Historic Places (NRHP) is the main focus of Misplaced Pages Takes Portland. In typical Misplaced Pages fashion, you can work individually or create a team.
Details and signup here!

--Another Believer _(Talk) 22:10, 1 September 2013 (UTC)

Malik Noureed Awan - which version should stand?

You have recently edited Malik Noureed Awan. Please see Talk:Malik Noureed Awan#Call for reasons why the NPOV/poorly-referenced version should stand and contribute your thoughts. davidwr/(talk)/(contribs) 19:06, 2 October 2013 (UTC)

Fluorine peer review

Hi YBG. You gave us great advice, 90% of which was incorporated. Can you have a re-look please (at peer review).71.127.137.171 (talk) 21:06, 6 October 2013 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages Edit-athon!

	WIKI LOVES LIBRARIES 2013! You're invited to attend the upcoming "Wiki Loves Libraries" edit-athon. The event will be held from 1–4pm on Sunday, October 13, 2013 at the Portland Art Museum's Crumpacker Family Library, located on the second floor of the Museum's Mark Building (formerly the Masonic Temple). The edit-athon will focus on the local arts community (but you can work on other topics as well!). It will also kick off the Oregon Arts Project, an on-wiki initiative to improve coverage of the arts in Oregon. Details and signup here!

WIKI LOVES LIBRARIES 2013!
You're invited to attend the upcoming "Wiki Loves Libraries" edit-athon. The event will be held from 1–4pm on Sunday, October 13, 2013 at the Portland Art Museum's Crumpacker Family Library, located on the second floor of the Museum's Mark Building (formerly the Masonic Temple). The edit-athon will focus on the local arts community (but you can work on other topics as well!). It will also kick off the Oregon Arts Project, an on-wiki initiative to improve coverage of the arts in Oregon. Details and signup here!

Hope to see you there! --Another Believer _(Talk) 15:55, 7 October 2013 (UTC)

The Non-metallic Barnstar

	The Non-metallic Barnstar for improving the Periodic Table For the contributions to the 420 day, 400k discussion in metalloids and non-metals from the early days into the closing consensus conclusions. It resulted in an improved Periodic Table. -DePiep (talk) 20:17, 27 October 2013 (UTC)

"Wiki Loves Libraries" edit-athon in Vancouver, WA

	WIKI LOVES LIBRARIES 2013! You are invited to attend the upcoming "Wiki Loves Libraries" edit-athon. The event will be held from 2:30–4:30pm on Sunday, November 17, 2013 at the Vancouver Community Library (901 C Street) in Vancouver, Washington. The edit-athon will focus on creating and expanding articles related to Vancouver and Clark County. Details and signup here!

You are receiving this message because you are listed as an active member of WikiProjectOregon or WikiProject Washington. This message was delivered by EdwardsBot (talk) 15:09, 9 November 2013 (UTC)

Vote: Group 3 metals; group 12 as poor metals

Should our 18-column periodic table show lutetium and lawrencium under scandium and yttrium, instead of all the lanthanides and actinides?
Should scandium, yttrium and the lanthanides together be coloured as rare earth metals?
Should zinc, cadmium and mercury be taken out of the transition metals element category and placed as poor metals?

As a member of WikiProject Elements, you are invited to comment and vote here. Double sharp (talk) 14:42, 28 November 2013 (UTC)

Criteria for categorization

These criteria were originally summarized as a part of the long discussion about categorizing nonmetals, but I believe they are just as easily applied to any categorization effort.

The first three points first appeared here:

1. Clear. The criterion for division should be easily explained

2. Unambiguous. It should be (relatively) obvious which category each element fits into

3. Meaningful. The categories should have significance more than just dividing for the sake of dividing.

There should be enough within-group similarity and enough between-group dissimilarity so that each group could be the subject of a separate encyclopedia article

Sandbh later named these the 'YBG rules', but I think they were really just summarizing the thoughts of others.

Other criteria mentioned in that discussion, not previously summarized, include these:

4. Referenced. Categories and their names are supported by reliable sources

5. Specific. Catch-all, none-of-the-above terms like 'Other X' are avoided (unless properties are not sufficiently known)

6. Unique. The categories are mutually exclusive (a bit stronger than Unambiguous)

7. Complete. The categories are jointly exhaustive (a bit stronger than Specific)’

I am writing this here to have it for reference and perhaps application in other areas. YBG (talk) 07:47, 6 December 2013 (UTC)

Get your cameras ready! Christmas in Oregon and PDX Pods

This month, WikiProject Oregon features two photo campaigns:

PDX Pods
Christmas in Oregon

The concept is simple: upload photos of these two topics and share your work! Whether you upload one or one hundred, these images will help capture the culture of our state and illustrate Wikimedia projects. Have fun, and happy holiday season! You are receiving this because you are listed as an active member of WikiProject Oregon or WikiProject Washington. This message was delivered on behalf of Misplaced Pages:Meetup/Portland by EdwardsBot (talk) 19:42, 6 December 2013 (UTC)

SWAT MATTA

Matta is Teh of district swaT KPK.

A WP-themed periodic table

The table

A periodic table showing the status of Misplaced Pages disambiguation pages for the elements
1 H																	2 He
3 Li	4 Be											5 B	6 C	7 N	8 O	9 F	10 Ne
11 Na	12 Mg											13 Al	14 Si	15 P	16 S	17 Cl	18 Ar
19 K	20 Ca	21 Sc	22 Ti	23 V	24 Cr	25 Mn	26 Fe	27 Co	28 Ni	29 Cu	30 Zn	31 Ga	32 Ge	33 As	34 Se	35 Br	36 Kr
37 Rb	38 Sr	39 Y	40 Zr	41 Nb	42 Mo	43 Tc	44 Ru	45 Rh	46 Pd	47 Ag	48 Cd	49 In	50 Sn	51 Sb	52 Te	53 I	54 Xe
55 Cs	56 Ba		72 Hf	73 Ta	74 W	75 Re	76 Os	77 Ir	78 Pt	79 Au	80 Hg	81 Tl	82 Pb	83 Bi	84 Po	85 At	86 Rn
87 Fr	88 Ra		104 Rf	105 Db	106 Sg	107 Bh	108 Hs	109 Mt	110 Ds	111 Rg	112 Cn	113 Uut	114 Fl	115 Uup	116 Lv	117 Uus	118 Uuo

		57 La	58 Ce	59 Pr	60 Nd	61 Pm	62 Sm	63 Eu	64 Gd	65 Tb	66 Dy	67 Ho	68 Er	69 Tm	70 Yb	71 Lu
		89 Ac?	90 Th	91 Pa	92 U	93 Np	94 Pu	95 Am	96 Cm	97 Bk	98 Cf	99 Es	100 Fm	101 Md	102 No	103 Lr

Article dab page		Class 1 (1 element) ] ]					Class 2 (44 elements) ] ]					Class 3 (77 elements) ] (no dab page)

Interestingly, mercury is an oddball in this table, as it is in the standard table -- but not because it is a liquid at room temperature. The classifying principle follows the three criteria I expressed in 2013 and most of the ones I added later:

Y Clear -- but I don't think it is very obvious, hence an appropriate subject for a puzzle like this.
Y Unambiguous -- but the classification can change over time
Y Meaningful -- in Misplaced Pages-space, but it has no physical or chemical significance.
N Referenced -- I am quite certain no reliable source would discuss this
Y Specific -- No catch-all classes like "Other X" nor even "Unknown"
Y Unique -- No overlap in classes, at least at a particular point in time
Y Complete -- Every element can be classified by this rule

I'm leaving the classification rule unstated for a few days to provide some entertainment to those who have spent a lot of time discussing the classification of the elements. I know this is somewhat unorthodox and is skirting close to the limits of what is appropriate on talk pages. After a few days, I'll provide the answer. YBG (talk) 17:39, 21 June 2014 (UTC)

@Double sharp: @Sandbh: @DePiep: You might be interested in this. Feel free to ping others. YBG (talk) 19:03, 21 June 2014 (UTC)

Comments

You are welcome to add your comments here.YBG (talk) 17:39, 21 June 2014 (UTC)

What theme are we talking about?

I reject each and every use of "category" outside of category-of-metalishness. Whatever yo want to say, find another word. (do not use "period", "group", "category"). -DePiep (talk) 23:06, 21 June 2014 (UTC)

OK, I've changed to use the word "class". My somewhat obtuse point here is that I have classified the elements in what I think is an interesting way and am wondering if others can guess the classification rule without me stating it. If this is not your cup of tea, forgive me for wasting your time. YBG (talk) 23:44, 21 June 2014 (UTC)

Well, actually I like the puzzle (it's just that the earlier version triggered my PT-Nazi-pavlov-language reflexes). -DePiep (talk) 14:27, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

I assume Hg is the exception because of the planet? (Is the god as significant of a factor?) Double sharp (talk) 13:14, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I expect so. YBG (talk) 16:25, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

We've marked bromine as liquid too. -DePiep (talk) 14:30, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

So Hg is even more exceptional in this table than in the standard one. All elements are unique, but some are more unique than others. YBG (talk) 16:25, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

LOL. 4 feet good, 2 feet better. Some elements sleep in human beds, you know? (btw, your Orwell quote is in two! handwritings. The latter half was added way after the AF revolution. That's what I enjoyed most of AF). -DePiep (talk) 21:11, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

I'd forgotten about the two handwritings ... so much so that when I saw your comment in my e-mail reader, I though that you were talking about what I had written, and wondering what you meant by handwriting in talk page comments. Sigh. YBG (talk) 00:24, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

Hey, it was you who started quoting AF! OK I'll link, but I was poking & notlinking by intention. -DePiep (talk) 00:57, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

I'll explain. You used the quote "All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others", from Animal Farm. In the book, the first half "All animals are equal" was a rule written on the wall at the revolution. Then, after the revolution was done the pigs went sleeping in the farmers bed, some animal added the second half ", but some ...". That's with all Rules they made (I don't have my copy at hand). So it is about how the revolution ended. I liked that refinement, but it is not used when quoted. -DePiep (talk) 10:34, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

Yea, I got that. It was just that when I read the e-mail notification with your comment out of context, I didn't immediately figure it all out. I had remembered that the 2nd part was added later, I just hadn't remembered that it was in a different handwriting. Oh, and it took me a little while to disambiguate AF, though I managed to figure it out without referring to AF, which wouldn't have helped at all. Go figure. I suppose it only serves me right for having started this thread as a puzzle. Turn about is fair play. YBG (talk) 13:02, 25 June 2014 (UTC)

Comments re hatnotes

Some years ago, I worked with hatnotes and disambiguation projects here (from the guidelines and so). Now here I see there are dozens! of ...(disambiguation) pages for element names. But only mercury (element) has a (dab) added to its title for the Hg page (you follow?). In other words: all these other elements have their element status as the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC (good for us=WP:ELEM). Its a large number. -DePiep (talk) 21:24, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

I don't see any glaring problems ... but it would be nice to ensure consistency between the pages, e.g., in ordering multiple ones and the like. And it might be worth considering whether it might be appropriate to create some more XXX (disambiguation) pages. I gathered them all together so that they could be seen in one place and so that inconsistencies might be more obvious. And, there should be some consistency between which hatnotes are present and whether there is a (disambiguation) page. I spent all my time gathering up the data, haven't spent too much time thinking about how to make it better. Incidentally, I gathered them up by using the "Edit" links shown and then I used the wikilink on element name to double-check stuff. YBG (talk) 00:24, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

Commendabele! This can improve out element pages.

Let me tell about hatnotes (informal). Originally, they were all about the "(disambiguation)" thing. It was the WP:DAB project commanding. In 9 out of 10 Category:Hatnote templates you still can see this. And also in you "YBG (disambiguation)" automated text, right? (Good & clear exception: {{main}}).

My advise: write your own hat text using {{hatnote}} (the anything-goes text template). Avoid each and every "(dab)" adding template, always write the hatnote yourself! -DePiep (talk) 01:12, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

I understand that {{hatnote}} may be helpful in combining the multiple hatnotes to conform to WP:1HAT. I'm not sure what you mean by "Avoid each and every '(dab)' adding template". YBG (talk) 07:13, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

I personally don't like these boilerplate templates, only to type the "(dab)" text automatically. Writing your own text can be more specific. More so in stacked hatnotes. But that's me. -DePiep (talk) 10:15, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

List of hatnotes

This table lists the hatnotes that exist on WP pages about the chemical elements.

Note: the redlinks shown here as "YBG (disambiguation)" appear in hatnotes as blue-links "Element-name (disambiguation)" using the actual element-name. YBG (talk) 17:54, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

The rows are colored the same as the PT above. OK, its ugly, but it communicates. Hope to change to just coloring the '*' column. YBG (talk) 18:31, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

I've reverted the colors back and am now just coloring one cell. YBG (talk) 03:47, 24 June 2014 (UTC)

element	Z	Sym	dab	Text of hatnotes (sort by number of hatnotes and then by text)
hydrogen	1	H	2 edit	{{Two other uses\|the chemistry of hydrogen\|the physics of atomic hydrogen\|Hydrogen atom\|other meanings\|Hydrogen (disambiguation)}} This page is about the chemistry of hydrogen. For the physics of atomic hydrogen, see Hydrogen atom. For other meanings, see Hydrogen (disambiguation).
helium	2	He	2 edit	{{About\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
lithium	3	Li	2 edit	{{About\|the chemical element\|the use of lithium as a medication\|Lithium (medication)\|other uses\|Lithium (disambiguation)}} This page is about the chemical element. For the use of lithium as a medication, see Lithium (medication). For other uses, see Lithium (disambiguation).
beryllium	4	Be	3 edit
boron	5	B	2 edit	{{about\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation). {{distinguish2\|], a tungsten carbide product}} Template:Distinguish2
carbon	6	C	2 edit	{{about\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
nitrogen	7	N	3 edit
oxygen	8	O	2 edit	{{About\|the chemical element and its most stable form, {{chem\|O\|2}} or dioxygen\|other forms of this element\|Allotropes of oxygen\|other uses\|Oxygen (disambiguation)\|and\|O2 (disambiguation)}} This page is about the chemical element and its most stable form, O ₂ or dioxygen. For other forms of this element, see Allotropes of oxygen. For other uses, see Oxygen (disambiguation) and O2 (disambiguation).
fluorine	9	F	3 edit
neon	10	Ne	2 edit	{{About\|the noble gas}} This page is about the noble gas. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
sodium	11	Na	3 edit	{{about\|the chemical element\|the PlayStation Home game\|Sodium (PlayStation Home)\|the racehorse\|Sodium (horse)}} This page is about the chemical element. For the PlayStation Home game, see Sodium (PlayStation Home). For the racehorse, see Sodium (horse). {{Redirect\|Natrium\|the town in West Virginia\|Natrium, West Virginia}} "Natrium" redirects here. For the town in West Virginia, see Natrium, West Virginia.
magnesium	12	Mg	3 edit	{{Distinguish\|Manganese}} Not to be confused with Manganese.
aluminium	13	Al	2 edit	{{About\|the metallic element}} This page is about the metallic element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
silicon	14	Si	3 edit	{{Distinguish2\|the silicon-containing synthetic polymer ]}} Template:Distinguish2 {{Redir\|Element 14\|other uses\|Element 14 (disambiguation)}} "Element 14" redirects here. For other uses, see Element 14 (disambiguation).
phosphorus	15	P	2 edit	{{About\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
sulfur	16	S	2 edit	{{About\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
chlorine	17	Cl	3 edit	{{About\|the chemical element\|the bleach\|Sodium hypochlorite\|the film\|Chlorine (film)}} This page is about the chemical element. For the bleach, see Sodium hypochlorite. For the film, see Chlorine (film). {{redirect4\|Cl\|Cl2\|other uses\|] and ]}} Template:Redirect4
argon	18	Ar	2 edit	{{About\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation). {{Distinguish\|Argonne (disambiguation)}} Not to be confused with Argonne (disambiguation).
potassium	19	K	3 edit
calcium	20	Ca	3 edit	{{About\|the metallic element\|the place\|Calcium, New York}} This page is about the metallic element. For the place, see Calcium, New York.
scandium	21	Sc	3 edit	{{Distinguish\|Scandinavium}} Not to be confused with Scandinavium. {{redirect\|Element 21\|the golf company\|Element 21 (company)}} "Element 21" redirects here. For the golf company, see Element 21 (company).
titanium	22	Ti	2 edit	{{about\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
vanadium	23	V	3 edit
chromium	24	Cr	2 edit	{{About\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
manganese	25	Mn	2 edit	{{distinguish\|Magnesium}} Not to be confused with Magnesium. {{other uses}} For other uses, see User talk:YBG (disambiguation).
iron	26	Fe	2 edit	{{about\|the metallic element}} This page is about the metallic element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
cobalt	27	Co	2 edit	{{about\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
nickel	28	Ni	2 edit	{{About\|the chemical element\|coins known as "nickels" and other uses\|Nickel (disambiguation)}} This page is about the chemical element. For coins known as "nickels" and other uses, see Nickel (disambiguation).
copper	29	Cu	2 edit	{{Other uses}} For other uses, see User talk:YBG (disambiguation).
zinc	30	Zn	2 edit	{{About\|the metallic element}} This page is about the metallic element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
gallium	31	Ga	2 edit	{{distinguish2\|the genus, '']''}} Template:Distinguish2 {{About\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
germanium	32	Ge	3 edit	{{distinguish\|Geranium}} Not to be confused with Geranium.
arsenic	33	As	3 edit
selenium	34	Se	2 edit	{{about\|the chemical element\|the software testing framework\|Selenium (software)}} This page is about the chemical element. For the software testing framework, see Selenium (software).
bromine	35	Br	3 edit
krypton	36	Kr	2 edit	{{about\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
rubidium	37	Rb	3 edit
strontium	38	Sr	2 edit	{{other uses}} For other uses, see User talk:YBG (disambiguation).
yttrium	39	Y	3 edit	{{distinguish\|ytterbium}} Not to be confused with ytterbium.
zirconium	40	Zr	3 edit	{{distinguish\|zircon\|zirconia\|cubic zirconia}} Not to be confused with zircon, zirconia, or cubic zirconia. {{Redirect\|Zr\|\|ZR (disambiguation){{!}}ZR}} "Zr" redirects here. For other uses, see ZR. Done Change to the following: {{Redirect\|Zr\|\|ZR (disambiguation)}} "Zr" redirects here. For other uses, see ZR (disambiguation).
niobium	41	Nb	3 edit
molybdenum	42	Mo	3 edit
technetium	43	Tc	3 edit
ruthenium	44	Ru	3 edit
rhodium	45	Rh	3 edit
palladium	46	Pd	2 edit	{{About\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
silver	47	Ag	2 edit	{{Two other uses\|the chemical element\|the color\|Silver (color)}} This page is about the chemical element. For the color, see Silver (color). For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
cadmium	48	Cd	3 edit
indium	49	In	3 edit	{{Distinguish\|Iridium}} Not to be confused with Iridium.
tin	50	Sn	2 edit	{{About\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
antimony	51	Sb	3 edit	{{about\|the element\|the town\|Antimony, Utah\|the mountain\|Antimony Peak\|the paradox\|Antinomy}} This page is about the element. For the town, see Antimony, Utah. For the mountain, see Antimony Peak. For the paradox, see Antinomy.
tellurium	52	Te	3 edit
iodine	53	I	2 edit	{{About\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
xenon	54	Xe	2 edit	{{about\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
caesium	55	Cs	3 edit
barium	56	Ba	2 edit	{{distinguish\|Bohrium\|Borium\|Boron}} Not to be confused with Bohrium, Borium, or Boron.
lanthanum	57	La	3 edit
cerium	58	Ce	3 edit
praseodymium	59	Pr	3 edit
neodymium	60	Nd	3 edit
promethium	61	Pm	2 edit	{{other uses}} For other uses, see User talk:YBG (disambiguation).
samarium	62	Sm	3 edit
europium	63	Eu	3 edit
gadolinium	64	Gd	3 edit
terbium	65	Tb	3 edit
dysprosium	66	Dy	3 edit
holmium	67	Ho	3 edit
erbium	68	Er	3 edit
thulium	69	Tm	3 edit	{{distinguish\|Thallium\|Thorium}} Not to be confused with Thallium or Thorium.
ytterbium	70	Yb	3 edit	{{distinguish\|yttrium}} Not to be confused with yttrium.
lutetium	71	Lu	3 edit
hafnium	72	Hf	3 edit
tantalum	73	Ta	3 edit
tungsten	74	W	2 edit	{{About\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
rhenium	75	Re	3 edit	{{about\|the chemical element\|the Parliament album\|Rhenium (album)}} This page is about the chemical element. For the Parliament album, see Rhenium (album).
osmium	76	Os	2 edit	{{for\|album by Parliament\|Osmium (album)}} For album by Parliament, see Osmium (album).
iridium	77	Ir	2 edit	{{distinguish\|Indium}} Not to be confused with Indium. {{About\|the chemical element\|other uses\|Iridium (disambiguation)}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see Iridium (disambiguation).
platinum	78	Pt	2 edit	{{about\|the chemical element\|other uses\|Platinum (disambiguation)}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see Platinum (disambiguation).
gold	79	Au	2 edit	{{Redirect\|Element 79\|the short story and anthology by Fred Hoyle\|Element 79 (anthology)}} "Element 79" redirects here. For the short story and anthology by Fred Hoyle, see Element 79 (anthology). {{Two other uses\|the metal\|the color\|Gold (color)}} This page is about the metal. For the color, see Gold (color). For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
mercury	80	Hg	1 edit	{{About\|the element\|other uses\|Mercury (disambiguation)}} This page is about the element. For other uses, see Mercury (disambiguation).
thallium	81	Tl	3 edit	{{distinguish\|Thulium\|Thorium}} Not to be confused with Thulium or Thorium.
lead	82	Pb	2 edit	{{About\|the metal}} This page is about the metal. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
bismuth	83	Bi	3 edit
polonium	84	Po	3 edit
astatine	85	At	3 edit
radon	86	Rn	2 edit	{{About\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
francium	87	Fr	3 edit
radium	88	Ra	2 edit	{{about\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
actinium	89	Ac	3 edit
thorium	90	Th	3 edit	{{Distinguish\|Thallium\|Thulium}} Not to be confused with Thallium or Thulium.
protactinium	91	Pa	3 edit
uranium	92	U	2 edit	{{about\|the chemical element}} This page is about the chemical element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
neptunium	93	Np	3 edit
plutonium	94	Pu	2 edit	{{About\|the radioactive element}} This page is about the radioactive element. For other uses, see YBG (disambiguation).
americium	95	Am	3 edit
curium	96	Cm	3 edit	{{about\|the chemical element\|the ancient city located in Cyprus\|Kourion}} This page is about the chemical element. For the ancient city located in Cyprus, see Kourion.
berkelium	97	Bk	3 edit
californium	98	Cf	3 edit
einsteinium	99	Es	3 edit	{{Redirect\|Athenium\|\|Athenaeum (disambiguation){{!}}Athenaeum}} "Athenium" redirects here. For other uses, see Athenaeum. Done change to the following: {{Redirect\|Athenium\|\|Athenaeum (disambiguation)}} "Athenium" redirects here. For other uses, see Athenaeum (disambiguation).
fermium	100	Fm	3 edit	{{Distinguish2\|]}} Template:Distinguish2
mendelevium	101	Md	3 edit
nobelium	102	No	3 edit
lawrencium	103	Lr	3 edit
rutherfordium	104	Rf	3 edit
dubnium	105	Db	3 edit
seaborgium	106	Sg	3 edit
bohrium	107	Bh	3 edit	{{distinguish\|Borium\| Boron\| Barium}} Not to be confused with Borium, Boron, or Barium.
hassium	108	Hs	3 edit
meitnerium	109	Mt	3 edit
darmstadtium	110	Ds	3 edit
roentgenium	111	Rg	3 edit
copernicium	112	Cn	3 edit
ununtrium	113	Uut	3 edit	{{Redirect\|Uut}} "Uut" redirects here. For other uses, see Uut (disambiguation).
flerovium	114	Fl	3 edit
ununpentium	115	Uup	3 edit	{{Redirect2\|Uup\|UUp\|the political party\|Ulster Unionist Party}} "Uup" and "UUp" redirect here. For the political party, see Ulster Unionist Party. {{Redirect\|Element 115\|fictional and conspiracy references to element 115\|Materials science in science fiction}} "Element 115" redirects here. For fictional and conspiracy references to element 115, see Materials science in science fiction. Note: These pages don't exist: Uup (disambiguation), UUP (disambiguation)
livermorium	116	Lv	3 edit
ununseptium	117	Uus	3 edit	{{Redir\|Uus\|other uses\|UUS}} "Uus" redirects here. For other uses, see UUS. Done Add the above
ununoctium	118	Uuo	3 edit	Note: These pages don't exist: UUO, Uuo (disambiguation), UUO (disambiguation)

Just curious: YBG, what is your impression with these hatnotes? Any itching or ideas? -DePiep (talk) 21:14, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

Burnside Bridge

Thanks for participating in this quadrant/neighborhood discussion. I don't think the Burnside Bridge article should be included in the Southeast Portland category if it is already labeled with the Buckman neighborhood category, which is itself a subcategory of the Southeast Portland category. Ideally, the article would only appear in neighborhood categories and not quadrant categories. However, in this case, Old Town Chinatown screws that up a little since it straddles Burnside and therefore cannot be labeled a subcategory of either NW Portland or SW Portland. But if we can categorize the bridge by its two eastside neighborhoods (one NE and one SE), and keep them from the parent NE and SE quadrant categories. ---Another Believer _(Talk) 00:17, 21 December 2014 (UTC)

NW, NE, and SE were already present, so I merely added SW. Although in general, I think it is better not to include an article in both a sub-category and in a super-category, I would take an exception in this case. If you include NW and SW but exclude NE and SE, it actually makes it appear that the bridge is NOT in the NE and SE quadrants. YBG (talk) 06:00, 21 December 2014 (UTC)

Properties of metals, metalloids and nonmetals

Improvements are very good; the colour scheme is insipid, noting this came with the template. Can you do better colours? I thought black, grey and white, although so much black in the metals column, with white text, might be overpowering. Sandbh (talk) 01:49, 30 December 2014 (UTC)

I wouldn't have chosen those colors, but I do really like using the same colors as the template; then it ties in with the mini-PT in the lead. Whatever insipidness is in the tables on this page, is also present in the mini-PT. So I'd recommend changing the template colors and letting them propogate. I reckon that the color choices were probably based on what I think is a false assumption -- that the metal (and nonmetal) color of {{Element color#Metal–nonmetal categories, reduced set}} must necessarily be highly distinct from the corresponding colors in {{Element color#Metal–nonmetal categories}}. YBG (talk) 04:54, 30 December 2014 (UTC)

Agree. Mini-PT is an image that can easily be updated. First thing to do is pick the colour scheme. White (metals)-Grey-Yellow? Sandbh (talk) 06:34, 31 December 2014 (UTC)

What I have in mind is modifying the color scheme itself. I think the hierarchy is something like this:

Metals → #eee8aa

Alkali metals → #ff9d9d

Alkaline earth metals → #ffdead

Transition metal → #ffc0c0

(Transition metals that are not inner transition metals)

Inner transition metals → #d8bfd8

Lanthanides → #ffbfff

Actinide → #ff99cc

Superactinide → #d1ddff

Eka-superactinide → #c6dd9d

Post-transition metal → #cccccc

Metalloids → #cccc99

Nonmetals → #b0e0e6

Diatomic nonmetal → #e7ff8f

Polyatomic nonmetal → #a1ffc3

Noble gas → #c0ffff

It seems to me that the colors ought to thematically 'roll-up' -- so I'm thinking the metal color ought to be something on the warm end of the spectrum, the nonmetal, on the cool end, and the metaloid something in between. The three colors generally seem to satisfy these criteria, and I think any change ought to remain within these parameters -- at least unless a wholesale revision of the scheme is being considered. I'm not pushing for change, I'm OK with how the colors show in the article. But then my sense of color composition is pretty appalling. YBG (talk) 08:16, 31 December 2014 (UTC)

I'm getting used to the colour scheme in the main tables. But the way these colours look in the lede table is stil unsatisfactory. The table is so small that they run into one another. Sandbh (talk) 10:45, 1 January 2015 (UTC)

Maybe it would be better for the lead to use {{Periodic table (metals and nonmetals)}}. YBG (talk) 17:05, 1 January 2015 (UTC)

Template:Periodic table (metals and nonmetals)

Give metalloids a border

Here's an idea:

The general idea is to make the metalloids stand out by giving them a border that the metals and nonmetals lack. Since the metalloids generally form the boundary, that might be enough to keep things from running together. What do you think of this?

(By the way, the top and bottom rows seem to be a bit thinner than the other rows; I'm not sure if this is an optical delusion or result of my formatting, but I think you can get the general idea) YBG (talk) 07:37, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

Let's give that a go! Sandbh (talk) 08:38, 4 January 2015 (UTC)

Evaluation and further thoughts

Shall I join in about the colors? -DePiep 23:15, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

Sure!YBG (talk) 00:17, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

Keep in mind that there are more than one issue

(1) What are the best colors to use for {{element color|metals}}, {{element color|metalloids}}, and {{element color|nonmetals}}

(2) What is the best way to color the PT in Properties of metals, metalloids and nonmetals

(3) What is the best way to emphasize similarities & differences in the Comparison tables

IMHO, it is very important that (1) and (2) be the same, but there are other ways of doing (3). If shading color is used, I think it very advantageous to use the same color scheme as (1) and (2). But there are other possibilities that could be used in conjunction with or in place of the current scheme. I'm going to try some. YBG (talk) 04:52, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

Here's what I promised

Property	Metals	Metalloids	Nonmetals
Prop1	Prop1a	Prop1b	Prop1c
Prop2	Prop2a	Prop2b	Prop2c
Prop3	Prop3a	Prop3b	Prop3c

The color boxes could be in addition to or in place of the shading. Sorting could be worked out to allow sorting by typology, which amounts to sorting by the matallicity of the metalloids, and then re-sorting back to the normal order. I don't think there is much advantage to sorting by the right three columns.

Another possibility: leave out the shading and removing the vertical bar on the left of the Metalloid column when metalloids are like metals and removing the bar on the right when metalloids are like nonmetals.

YBG (talk) 05:41, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

Background info on the color options

Background info on the color options
Quick first replies: For starters, we (you) are free to choose the three key colors for the three classes. So far, they were used rarely, so have not been scrutinized yet. Some guidance exists though: The brown for metalloids now is the same as in the regular category legend. Would be good if we can maintain that (enwiki-wide), but - see below. The yellow and blue (metal, nonmetal) were chosen for being very apart in the three-set. Also they better not associate with an existing category-color (eg,. should not look like the Ln pinkish). Being a bg color, they need to be light for contrast (black font, wikilink blue font). We could make a notch lighter colors for the big table background, and darker ones for the mini PT tables. The brown for metalloids is a horrible color to use as a key. We inherited it from the early PT days on wiki. More bad colors in the category legend (Template:Periodic_table_legend#Category, 12 key colors + grey for unk): alkali red is too dark; PTM: grey should be for unknown and table borders; metalloids brown is off; not evenly spread (many reds, few yellow/blues). Fixing this is an effort I have on my list, but its big. The 12 keys leave few degrees of freedom (ad we the need for (predicted) variants). Brown in this three-set also turns out bad: Sandbh needed to stress them with borders! re YBG stating that the three should be related to the 12 categories: good idea, but keep that secondary impotrtance. These color sets rarely show on the same page. This could be too much of a requirement. Also, the 12 categories are colored uneven, and so today are a bad base. Colortech talk: The lightness for a chosen "color" (=point on the rainbow) is more easily set using HSV not RGB color space (it's a calculateable conversion). Because, "H" is the rainbow-color number, and S,V set the lightness (see table in Help:Using_colours). Inversely, if you keep S,V the same with different H-colors, their shade is nicely alike. End of Colortech talk. I suggest: Yes keep (1)(2)(3) rules. Maybe leave the brown for metalloid, because it is too indifferent. (can change if the 12-cat colors have been redesigned). Think of lighter shades in the table (but with the same Hue-color). Forget mostly about the "link to 12-cat colors", but maybe use "reddish-yellowish!-blueish" (btw, isn't blue-greyish not nicer for metals?). -DePiep (talk) 11:08, 6 January 2015 (UTC) Shorter, 1st question: shall we drop the brown=metalloid for this PT and select three good colors, or keep that connection with the general PTs? -DePiep (talk) 12:40, 6 January 2015 (UTC) I am in favor of having the mini-PT use the standard legend colors for metal/metalloid/nonmetal. My preferences would be (a) change nothing; keep the colors as they are (b) change metal/nonmetal; keep metalloid (this has relatively little impact) (c) change metal/metalloid/nonmetal; keep the rest of the color scheme unchanged (d) rethink the entire color scheme The reason for this order is that right now, I'd prefer not getting into the longer, more drawn-out deliberations that could be involved further down the list. But if anyone has some ideas about what the color scheme ought to be in the long run, it would be good to let that inform what we do in the short term. I have a few ideas about what I'd like to see in a major re-think of colors, but I won't muddy the waters now. YBG (talk) 17:56, 6 January 2015 (UTC) The 12-category colors are not up for change here. It just explains where the brown comes from. So (d) is out of the question here. Option (b) or (c) are both easy, because this set of three is only used within this topic. If you change brown-metalloid (c), you can end up with a better color but loose the 1:1 connection with the other templates. Any color preferences for the two/three, if change one at all? -DePiep (talk) 18:52, 6 January 2015 (UTC) Glad to hear that (d) is off the table; it certainly makes things much easier. Implied in all 4 options (a), (b), (c), and (d) is that the mini-PT displayed at Properties of metals, metalloids and nonmetals should be coded to use these three colors: {{element color\|metals}}, {{element color\|metalloids}}, and {{element color\|nonmetals}}. The difference between these options is what specific colors are used by {{element color}} to represent metals, metalloids, and nonmetals. YBG (talk) 23:02, 6 January 2015 (UTC) Yes, `{{element color}}` is where the color will be entered. Any change you prefer? Or keep current? (yellowish too light imo). -DePiep (talk) 23:34, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

Quick first replies:

For starters, we (you) are free to choose the three key colors for the three classes. So far, they were used rarely, so have not been scrutinized yet. Some guidance exists though:

The brown for metalloids now is the same as in the regular category legend. Would be good if we can maintain that (enwiki-wide), but - see below.

The yellow and blue (metal, nonmetal) were chosen for being very apart in the three-set. Also they better not associate with an existing category-color (eg,. should not look like the Ln pinkish).

Being a bg color, they need to be light for contrast (black font, wikilink blue font). We could make a notch lighter colors for the big table background, and darker ones for the mini PT tables.

The brown for metalloids is a horrible color to use as a key. We inherited it from the early PT days on wiki. More bad colors in the category legend (Template:Periodic_table_legend#Category, 12 key colors + grey for unk): alkali red is too dark; PTM: grey should be for unknown and table borders; metalloids brown is off; not evenly spread (many reds, few yellow/blues). Fixing this is an effort I have on my list, but its big. The 12 keys leave few degrees of freedom (ad we the need for (predicted) variants).

Brown in this three-set also turns out bad: Sandbh needed to stress them with borders!

re YBG stating that the three should be related to the 12 categories: good idea, but keep that secondary impotrtance. These color sets rarely show on the same page. This could be too much of a requirement. Also, the 12 categories are colored uneven, and so today are a bad base.

Colortech talk: The lightness for a chosen "color" (=point on the rainbow) is more easily set using HSV not RGB color space (it's a calculateable conversion). Because, "H" is the rainbow-color number, and S,V set the lightness (see table in Help:Using_colours). Inversely, if you keep S,V the same with different H-colors, their shade is nicely alike. End of Colortech talk.

I suggest: Yes keep (1)(2)(3) rules. Maybe leave the brown for metalloid, because it is too indifferent. (can change if the 12-cat colors have been redesigned). Think of lighter shades in the table (but with the same Hue-color). Forget mostly about the "link to 12-cat colors", but maybe use "reddish-yellowish!-blueish" (btw, isn't blue-greyish not nicer for metals?). -DePiep (talk) 11:08, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

Shorter, 1st question: shall we drop the brown=metalloid for this PT and select three good colors, or keep that connection with the general PTs? -DePiep (talk) 12:40, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

I am in favor of having the mini-PT use the standard legend colors for metal/metalloid/nonmetal. My preferences would be

(a) change nothing; keep the colors as they are

(b) change metal/nonmetal; keep metalloid (this has relatively little impact)

(d) rethink the entire color scheme

The reason for this order is that right now, I'd prefer not getting into the longer, more drawn-out deliberations that could be involved further down the list. But if anyone has some ideas about what the color scheme ought to be in the long run, it would be good to let that inform what we do in the short term. I have a few ideas about what I'd like to see in a major re-think of colors, but I won't muddy the waters now. YBG (talk) 17:56, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

The 12-category colors are not up for change here. It just explains where the brown comes from. So (d) is out of the question here.

Option (b) or (c) are both easy, because this set of three is only used within this topic. If you change brown-metalloid (c), you can end up with a better color but loose the 1:1 connection with the other templates. Any color preferences for the two/three, if change one at all? -DePiep (talk) 18:52, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

Glad to hear that (d) is off the table; it certainly makes things much easier. Implied in all 4 options (a), (b), (c), and (d) is that the mini-PT displayed at Properties of metals, metalloids and nonmetals should be coded to use these three colors: {{element color|metals}}, {{element color|metalloids}}, and {{element color|nonmetals}}. The difference between these options is what specific colors are used by {{element color}} to represent metals, metalloids, and nonmetals. YBG (talk) 23:02, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

Yes, {{element color}} is where the color will be entered. Any change you prefer? Or keep current? (yellowish too light imo). -DePiep (talk) 23:34, 6 January 2015 (UTC)

I'm not pressing to change them; they can stay the way they are. I think Sandbh had two concerns:

(1) colour scheme is insipid (but he later said he was getting used to it)

(2) mini-PT didn't have enough differentiation (to be resolved with borders on the metalloid cells)

So it seems to me that the main issues have been resolved. I say, leave it as is, but if others disagree, I'm also fine with making changes. YBG (talk) 00:32, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

Or if we do change, one choice would be to use a light bluish-silvery-grey for metals and a yellow for nonmetals. YBG (talk) 00:38, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

Color scheme is OK; wouldn't mind seeing what light bluish-silvery-grey for metals and a yellow for nonmetals would look like. Sandbh (talk) 01:38, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

I think the color used for metals is closer to the metalloid brown than the color of nonmetals, but both should be equally distant from it. Not that I was thoroughly checking against that (that would be pointless), it just caught the eye too easily. I guess because brown is the dark yellow? Hasn't that occurred to anyone else? --R8R (talk) 14:41, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

As said, within some guidelines the yellowish and bluish were picked at random. I don't have enough time to make new proposals now. Note that this is secondary to (merged) article quality. Spend time elsewhere? -DePiep (talk) 14:55, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

Sure, it's not the top priority or anything. I thought it was worth noting, but if it's just me, I'll easily deal with it. If not, I don't know. At least it was stated and we are aware of it and right, it's still a secondary thing. I wouldn't sit down and think what colors would be better either.--R8R (talk) 15:21, 7 January 2015 (UTC)

Received well, R8R. Just showing my anger at myself for not being able to give this topic a rest ;-). -DePiep (talk) 07:59, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

Polite, concise, effective.

The 'D' in WP:BRD means discuss on the talk page, not in edit summaries. - Nicely done! (I'm envious of your skill(s)). Pdfpdf (talk) 11:15, 23 January 2015 (UTC)

Oh, dear: I must confess that I'm often very guilty of this one. I'll try to stop doing that! Double sharp (talk) 13:28, 20 August 2015 (UTC)

In many cases, I wouldn't be quite so dogmatic. But consider this history of edits:

Ed1: (bold) Lots of changes with no edit summary
Ed2: (revert) Reverted the above with this edit summary:
"I rather like some (not all) of the changes you have made, but per WP:BRD, I suggest discussing them on the talk page is the best way forward."
Ed1: (discuss?) Restored original edit, marking it as 'minor', with edit summary:
"Shouldn't have to discuss something that warrants change, the article is too image heavy early on, there's a gallery before any information? Gallerie belong at the end of the page. It also needed a detailed geography run down, tell me what you."
YBG: Re-reverted with edit summary:
"The 'D' in WP:BRD means discuss on the talk page, not in edit summaries."

It seems that in this case, Ed1 committed several faux pas:

Complex edit with no edit summary
Declined to discuss in the forum requested by Ed2
Marked edit as minor, contrary to WP:minor edit, where it says:
- "If there is any chance that another editor might dispute a change, it is best not to mark the edit as minor."
- "Reverting a page is not likely to be considered minor under most circumstances. When the status of a page is disputed, and particularly if an edit war is brewing, then it is better not to mark any edit as minor. Reverting blatant vandalism is an exception to this rule."

Without these, I may not have insisted "the 'D' in WP:BRD means discuss on the talk page, not in edit summaries". YBG (talk) 01:31, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

DB

Somehow I've gotten sucked up into what seems to an outsider as a quasi-religious edit war.

This page was watchlisted since I had made a small edit to the lead back in June 2014. So when Ahunt made a change, citing the 'longstanding consensus; at MOS:LINUX, and was then reverted by Dsprc, I jumped in and restored the page back to Ahunt's version, saying "Please read previously cited MOS" in my edit summary. Ahunt later thanked me for this edit. Dsprc then reverted my edit, with an edit summary that made me go back and re-read MOS:LINUX. My understanding of the MOS, which Ahunt cites but Dsprc says is POV, is that WP should use "GNU/Linus" only as part of the formal title of a distribution, not elsewhere. I have no opinion as to whether that is a good MOS or not. But based on that, I looked at dyne:bolic and then later at their website (in the legalese at the bottom of the page) and became convinced that the formal title for this thing is "dyne:bolic GNU/Linux". Consequently, it seemed to me that I could make Ahunt happy by confirming to the MOS and make Dsprc happy by including the GNU/ prefix if I reworded the dab item to use "dyne:bolic GNU/Linux" as the title, followed by a comma, and a description "a distribution of the Linux operating system".

Ahunt then removed the "GNU/Linux", which Dsprc restored. Ahunt then shortened the dab entry, which was reverted by Dsprc.

I'm sorely tempted to say 'a pox on both your houses', but then one thing I really like about WP is that I have seen people have very strong opinions, disagree, and then finally come together. I've often been the one that needed convincing, but occasionally I've been the one who has been persuasive. I'm hoping that in this current situation the editors could agree that the wording I inserted complies with MOS:LINUX and let it stand. YBG (talk) 00:18, 26 January 2015 (UTC)

Adelaide city centre

Howdy! As far as I'm concerned, I think "we are there".
And I think you feel the same. But I'm not sure about others. (None of which other than Ashton 29 have responded.)
Do I care? Well ... no and yes. But I do feel a little guilty that we may have "steamrollered" the result. On the other hand, we've given others PLENTY of opportunity to add their 2c - hence, only a "little" guilty.
So! What's stopping you/(us) closing the matter? (Other than guilt?) Pdfpdf (talk) 14:02, 27 January 2015 (UTC)

Grid example

a0	a1	a2	a3

b0	b1	b2	b3

c0	c1	c2	c3

d0	d1	d2	d3

Disambiguation link notification for February 2

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Misplaced Pages appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited Properties of metals, metalloids and nonmetals, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Insulator (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

It's OK to remove this message. Also, to stop receiving these messages, follow these opt-out instructions. Thanks, DPL bot (talk) 09:15, 2 February 2015 (UTC)

Collapsing tables and widths

This help request has been answered. If you need more help, you can ask another question on your talk page, contact the responding user(s) directly on their user talk page, or consider visiting the Teahouse.

I'm looking for some rather technical help in formatting tables. I recently reformatted the information at Properties of metals, metalloids and nonmetals § Comparisons (permalink) to use collapsing sub-tables. My problem is that the column widths of the different sub-tables don't match. I see a slight improvement if I expand all sub-tables and if remove the collapsible parameter. I'd really like the column widths to match exactly. What am I missing? YBG (talk) 22:26, 8 February 2015 (UTC)

YBG, I believe the issue is that you haven't actually specified the width of the tables themselves. "30em" is the minimum width of the table, so depending on the contents and browser being used the borders will change. The two possible solutions (that I can think of) are to either specifically define the width of the table, or specifically define the width of each column (I think the former is the better option). Personally, though, I would not split the two tables ("Physical properties" and "Chemical properties"), mainly based off this section. Up to you though. If you want more help, stop by the Teahouse, the IRC channel, or the help desk to ask someone for assistance. Primefac (talk) 22:45, 8 February 2015 (UTC)

FYI, in mobile view the collapse does not exist (is expanded always). And as Primefac noted, folded text in articles is bad for accessability (losing page overview). And at least I would make the two tables collapsing, not six. -DePiep (talk) 10:26, 9 February 2015 (UTC)

This has been overcome by events; we no longer have collapsing tables in the article. But there is an even bigger problem. It appears that tables do not appear at all when articles are printed or exported as PDFs. This seems to be a major problem. YBG (talk) 06:35, 22 February 2015 (UTC)

Groups

Pls take another look at Group (periodic table). As you left it, "Old" IUPAC now numbers 1--18, and "New" IUPAC has A-B subdivisions. -DePiep (talk) 23:52, 21 February 2015 (UTC)

Oops. It has now been fixed. YBG (talk) 06:38, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

Texas vs. Florida

Great thing about Misplaced Pages, great minds like ours get together and become more the the sum of our parts. Nice working with you. Czolgolz (talk) 01:55, 16 April 2015 (UTC)

Heavy metals etc

I think I have it now. Created a new article: Heavy metal (chemical element); changed the title of the old Heavy metal (chemistry) article to Toxic heavy metal. Sandbh (talk) 01:50, 10 May 2015 (UTC)

That is a great solution, especially since it allows light and heavy metal (chemical element) to be contrasted nicely. By the way, it might be nice to expand toxic heavy metal § benefits with historical sidelights, for example the failure of early Kangaroo Island settlements due to a deficiency of copper. YBG (talk) 03:32, 10 May 2015 (UTC)

Virginia Governors

Thank you for the info, surprising what a difference a "-" makes! Danthompson351 (talk) 03:13, 11 May 2015 (UTC)

Your welcome! YBG (talk) 03:23, 11 May 2015 (UTC)

This was in response to the following posted at User talk:Danthompson351 § Virginia governors, where I wrote:

I notice you've added a new section several times and reverted it after each attempt. I'm guessing that you reverted because it messed up the format. Your problem is that you've been ending the table with |-}, which is incorrect -- you actually need to end it with |}. If you'll look back at the history of the article, you will find a version where I inserted the section with the correct table-ending code and a few other changes I thought helpful. If you have any questions, ask them here and I'll try to respond. YBG (talk) 02:19, 11 May 2015 (UTC)

Yoghurt

I'm planning to write an article about Action on Sugar.Rathfelder (talk) 20:11, 14 May 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for the explanation. Feel free to restore the wikilink now or if you prefer, wait until a stub article is created.YBG (talk) 06:48, 15 May 2015 (UTC)

Poor man's interactivity

Instructions:

You can try to answer the question without seeing any of the possible answers
Click to reveal the possible choices (like a multiple-choice test)
Hover over the letter of your chosen answer to see if it is right and why or why not

What is the answer to this question?
(a) This is the answer.
(b) No this is the answer.
(c) This one is really right.
(d) No, it is this answer instead.

Venn diagrams from Commons

Venn0001.svg	Venn0010.svg	Venn0100.svg	Venn1000.svg
Venn_0000_0001.svg	Venn_0000_0010.svg	Venn_0000_0100.svg	Venn_0000_1000.svg
Venn_0001_0000.svg	Venn_0010_0000.svg	Venn_0100_0000.svg	Venn_1000_0000.svg

Response to your questions

I'm responding to your questions here, as I don't think it would be constructive to continue at DePiep's page while they remain blocked and upset. I'll take them in reverse order. Per WP:BLOCK: "Blocks serve to protect the project from harm, and reduce likely future problems." As there is a history of disruptive behavior with the user, and it repeated again with this incident, it was my opinion that it would lead to more problems if left unchecked. Per Misplaced Pages:Blocking_policy#Duration_of_blocks: "The duration of blocks should thus be related to the likelihood of a user repeating inappropriate behavior. Longer blocks for repeated and high levels of disruption is to reduce administrative burden; it is under presumption that such users are likely to cause frequent disruption or harm in future." I considered an indefinite block, and requiring a successful unblock appeal like in this case of persistent disruption, but opted instead for editing privileges to be regained automatically after 72 hours, at the latest. Their unblock request was denied by another admin. As I attempted to make clear earlier at WP:AN3, this block was motivated by the longer term pattern of behavior, not for the individual incident, which also explains my decision to—in your words—give "a pass" to the other party. I hope that explains things, even if you don't necessarily agree. Regards.—Bagumba (talk) 03:48, 2 August 2015 (UTC)

OK, @Bagumba:, I see that admin policy considers previous history in determining block length. You say "My preference is always to assume that warnings can be teaching moments, and let otherwise productive editors such as DePiep and Alakzi move on to more valuable edits without the need for a timeout." But in this case, one party received a 72-hour block and the other party was not even warned (unless I missed something). YBG (talk) 11:45, 2 August 2015 (UTC)

FWIW, there was this, which may or may not be what you were expecting.—Bagumba (talk) 23:19, 2 August 2015 (UTC)

You're right, Bagumba, it's not what I expected. But I do believe it is positive. Although it appears that I am reading only half of an extended conversation (one of my pet peeves), nevertheless, I can see that (a) you offered Alakzi a friendly suggestion for how to avoid edit warring and that (b) Alakzi responded with an acknowledgement of how he could have acted differently. That looks like a textbook example of the positive results of AGF. Thank you. YBG (talk) 01:01, 3 August 2015 (UTC)

Notice

Speedy deletion nomination of Interstate 91 in Vermont

A tag has been placed on Interstate 91 in Vermont requesting that it be speedily deleted from Misplaced Pages. This has been done for the following reason:

an article to be submitted shares this redirect's name. Please delete this redirect only when said article is submitted

Under the criteria for speedy deletion, pages that meet certain criteria may be deleted at any time.

If you think this page should not be deleted for this reason, you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. However, be aware that once a page is tagged for speedy deletion, it may be removed without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself, but do not hesitate to add information in line with Misplaced Pages's policies and guidelines. If the page is deleted, and you wish to retrieve the deleted material for future reference or improvement, then please contact the deleting administrator, or if you have already done so, you can place a request here. HeatIsCool (talk) 21:12, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

Looks good! Great to have proper article instead of just a redirect. YBG (talk) 21:18, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

Beaverton City Library

Thanks for creating a redirect. I went ahead and converted to a stub. :) ---Another Believer _(Talk) 14:16, 10 September 2015 (UTC)

Uus FAC

Hi! I know you're aware the Uus FAC is on, and you can see it's not really active; I'm afraid to see it close without getting just enough reception to stand a chance of getting promoted, again. Could you please review the thing? It would be so helpful for me right now; a favor in return would be on me.--R8R (talk) 16:43, 4 October 2015 (UTC)

Just a thought

I noticed that there was a dust-up about students making and reverting test edits.
Hypothetically, if each of your students were to get their own user name, they could create their own personal sand box(es) (as many as they wished) to which they could copy entire text from articles, and then alter them. They then could work on these till the cows come home. And there would be no conflict or cause for concern. Just a gentle suggestion from an outside disinterested party.
Feel free to disregard my message if you find it inappropriate, irrelevant, disrespectful or officious. I have the best of intentions, and none of these was intended.
FWIW, I want your students to succeed and to graduate into full-fledged wikipedia editors. We need all the help we can get. Best regards. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 16:59, 7 November 2015 (UTC)

@7&6=thirteen: No, I don't find your message objectionable in any way, but it does arouse my curiosity. I followed a recent 'dust-up' about a teacher making and reverting test edits, but I'm pretty sure I didn't even comment. I trust you won't find it objectionable if I ask you a question. What prompted you to leave me this message? I am puzzled. Thanks, and happy editing! YBG (talk) 20:25, 7 November 2015 (UTC)

I ran across it on somebody's talk page. I did not read it closely enough, I gather. Erroneously thought you were involved. Sorry for disturbing your tilling in the garden. Best regards. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 21:15, 7 November 2015 (UTC)

Any chance you can remember where? YBG (talk) 22:20, 7 November 2015 (UTC)

Hi there. Let me know if I can help. I might be "somebody". Cheers, Valfontis (talk) 07:03, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

No worries. I suspected that it might have been that my post at User talk:Valfontis § Please accept my sincere apology was immediately before the talk page section that discussed the "dust-up". Maybe @7&6=thirteen: could verify that was the place? YBG (talk) 21:33, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

I do think it was on one of those two pages. I am a talk page lurker (on both pages, I think), and learn a lot as I do that. I find interesting subjects, controversies, etc. Sometimes I see the world through a different lens. Occasionally I throw in my 2₵. Hope that helps. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 23:02, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

@7&6=thirteen: Hey, no worries. It was just really puzzling to me because I am not a teacher and don't have students. It has all been a good learning experience for me. I, too, have been a 'talk page lurker' and have on more than one occasion read things a bit too quickly and jumped to incorrect conclusions. Usually it has ended well, but occasionally I've unnecessarily caused confusion where there would otherwise have been none. So, happy editing! YBG (talk) 23:17, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

A Dobos torte for you!

7&6=thirteen (☎) has given you a Dobos Torte to enjoy! Seven layers of fun because you deserve it.

To give a Dobos Torte and spread the WikiLove, just place {{subst:Dobos Torte}} on someone else's talkpage, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend.

This template was my creation. Enjoy. Context is everything. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 00:46, 9 November 2015 (UTC)

@7&6=thirteen: Thanks. Looks like it might have 7 layers of cake & 6 layers of filling, making a total = thirteen. Mmmm.... YBG (talk) 01:03, 9 November 2015 (UTC)

ArbCom elections are now open!

Hi,
You appear to be eligible to vote in the current Arbitration Committee election. The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Misplaced Pages arbitration process. It has the authority to enact binding solutions for disputes between editors, primarily related to serious behavioural issues that the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the ability to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail. If you wish to participate, you are welcome to review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on the voting page. For the Election committee, MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 13:59, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

Infobox constitutional amendment

Riffing off our recent discussion in Talk:Seventeenth Amendment to the United States Constitution, I went ahead and created (in my sandbox) a draft {{infobox constitutional amendment}}, and started a discussion under the section Infobox constitutional amendment. Your input would be appreciated. TJRC (talk) 01:00, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

Template talk:United States presidential election, 2016

Per WP:BRD, I have posted to Template talk:United States presidential election, 2016 regarding whether Rod Silva (businessman) should be included on Template:United States presidential election, 2016. --Metropolitan90 (talk) 21:47, 25 December 2015 (UTC)

Record Franz Joseph I

I think Queen Elizabeth II would surpass Franz Joseph I on 28 January 2020 because Franz Joseph I reigned 68 years, 355 days. On 17 January 2020 Queen would reigning 68 years 344 days. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Miszaki89 (talk • contribs)

@Miszaki89: Thanks for promptly responding. Please discuss this at talk:List of monarchs in Britain by length of reign so that others can contribute to the discussion. Also, don't forget to sign by including ~~~~ at the end of your posts. If you want to make sure that someone is notified of a point on a talk page, use the {{ping}} template, like I have here. Thanks for your efforts to improve our encyclopedia! Cheers! YBG (talk) 23:18, 28 December 2015 (UTC)

Periodic table / other arrangements URL broken

Hi, this edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Periodic_table&type=revision&diff=696923579&oldid=696921424 broke the URL on the 'lemniscate' in the shaped like ... listing of https://en.wikipedia.org/Periodic_table#Other_arrangements. I can't fix it since the article is protected. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2620:0:105f:3:d887:1880:19fc:30 (talk • contribs) 13:53, 4 January 2016 (UTC)

@2620:0:105f:3:d887:1880:19fc:30: It looks like it was fixed by these edits. Thanks! YBG (talk) 06:58, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

Note to Reywas92

@Reywas92: Sometimes it works best to cite WP:MOS in edit summaries, e.g. MOS:QUOTEMARKS. But you seem to have come up with a fine comprise. That is what collaboration is all about. I well remember our work together at List of U.S. state abbreviations. It was my first significant WP collaboration. YBG (talk) 06:58, 19 January 2016 (UTC)

Block (periodic table)

Are you interested in writing it to eventually get a GA? I'd be glad to help you with that. I think this would be interesting for you as well.--R8R (talk) 16:19, 20 January 2016 (UTC)

@R8R Gtrs: Thought I had already replied to this, but apparently I failed to hit the "Save" button. Sigh. Long story short: sounds like an interesting project, but right now I'm fairly busy IRL and so I'll have to take a rain check. Feel free to go ahead without me if you wish; I've got it watchlisted and will chime in as my bandwidth allows. YBG (talk) 07:22, 26 January 2016 (UTC)

I don't think I'll go alone: I have a project to work on at the moment (lead), and I don't have too much time I could afford spending on Wiki. But I'm ready to provide a rain check when you're ready to take one.--R8R (talk) 07:25, 30 January 2016 (UTC)

OK, I'll let you k ow. YBG (talk) 17:49, 30 January 2016 (UTC)

One opinion requested

I remember you're American? If I'm not mistaken, then I'd like to ask a question re U.S. geography. Please tell me, from a perspective of a person who lives in the Western hemisphere, how well-known is the toponym of Ozarks? Is it universally understood throughout the U.S.? Any chances to estimate if it's recongnizable for people in Canada? Mexico? South America? I am quite familiar with the major landmarks in Europe and, in part, Asia, but I lack any knowledge of North American physical geography. I'm writing the history section of lead, and it mentions the Lead Belt in Missouri, but I'd like to get away from any states or stuff like that. There even wasn't a Missouri in 1700!

So, will the Americans (both the U.S.-born people and born elsewhere in the Americas) understand the toponym?--R8R (talk) 22:33, 5 February 2016 (UTC)

One more question: could you make similar estimations for the "Iberian peninsula" and "Anatolia"?--R8R (talk) 22:47, 5 February 2016 (UTC)

Ozarks should be fairly well understood in the US and probably in Canada, but I'm less certain about how familiar it would be to folks from Central or South America. Note that although it extends both north and south of the AR-MO state line (and, I see, even into OK and KS), I associate it mostly with Arkansas. It was a surprise to me when I read the article to see that there is a larger area in MO than in AR. But I'm not certain whether this is unique to me or if it extends more broadly. This could be related to the fact that its familiarity -- to me, and I believe in general -- stems mostly from being a very distinct cultural region, rather than being a geographical region.

Iberian peninsula is immediately understandable to me, perhaps because of studying Spanish in middle and high school. Anatolia, when I first saw it was familiar but I couldn't quite place it -- then as soon as the hovercard popped up, I slapped my head "Oh, yea, I should know that".

With regard to using toponymns, another alternative is to use phrases like "present-day Turkey" or the like.

Oh, and by the way, only the first opinion requested is free. Thereafter, the price of each subsequent opinion doubles. Cheers! YBG (talk) 23:46, 5 February 2016 (UTC)

I know that zero doubled is still zero :) Still, thank you very much for your cooperation.

Yes, I absolutely expected it to be culture-dependent. I just consulted a map, and it says my home city of Moscow is closer to Tehran than to Madrid; yet I know the geography, history, and culture of Spain a little, and I don't know any of these for Iran (I just know they're a very old civilization, with their origin dating back to well before the Common Era started. I also couldn't remember the name of the mountains Tehran stands on until I googled. Too bad). I know the U.S. and Canada are a common cultural space, with some exceptions both within and throughout the two countries, and I expected South America to be completely different than both, still... Mexico? As you can see, I'm not very well aware of how deep mutual cultural penetration in the Americas is. Hence these questions.

While I like the idea of maximum understandability (I always try to implement that in my Wiki-writing), I don't think it is right to say "modern-day Turkey" or the like. There was no Turkey back then, and I don't want to get it into the story, as it strays the reader from the main event sequence. I could even bear the Ozarks, which I had never heard of before this Friday. (Luckily, the Ozarks are no longer needed, as there was an earlier lead mine in the New World -- which I also don't want to call "the Americas" because "New World" seems to be a better choice for a discussion of the age of colonization of the Americas. "Colony of Virginia" should be okay for everyone, I think.)

Also, I stand corrected -- there was a Missouri in 1700. I forgot there was a river of that name. :) --R8R (talk) 20:32, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

Could I borrow ten minutes of your time to ask you to give the History section a read and see if the geography (and language) is understandable? (I can't alter the geography, of course, but I can add wikilinks, or specify things, or something else). Of course, it's not complete, but the time span yet to be covered should be easy enough for me to make judgments about accessibility myself.--R8R (talk) 15:57, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for February 7

Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Misplaced Pages appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited List of countries bordering on two or more oceans, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page South Pacific (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver). Such links are almost always unintended, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of "Did you mean..." article titles. Read the FAQ • Join us at the DPL WikiProject.

It's OK to remove this message. Also, to stop receiving these messages, follow these opt-out instructions. Thanks, DPL bot (talk) 10:51, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

Sidebar periodic table

I don't get what you are doing with {{Sidebar periodic table}}, but it does not look good. For example, using {{hr}} is out of date, and stacking effects too. OTOH, my /sandbox thing is really great and faultless and brilliant (... or at least you could take a look). DePiep (talk) 00:55, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

I have reverted everything except the swap of alternative and extended. I was just experimenting and hit "Save" without intending to. Sigh. If I'd been working in the sandbox, this wouldn't have happened. Thanks for the gracious response to my clumsiness. YBG (talk) 00:58, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

All fine. Now pls take a look at my brilliant /sandbox version :-) -DePiep (talk) 01:14, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

Doing that as we speak. YBG (talk) 01:20, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

Great. Did I mention I made a devastatingly good improved version? How cold I forget. Maybe I'm too shy. -DePiep (talk) 01:46, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

"Shy" and "DePiep" form a contradiction. Shall I add my comments here ... or at the template talk page? YBG (talk) 02:00, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

I see Template Talk is redirected to the project talk page. YBG (talk) 02:02, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

(ec) Nah, just copy into the main template what you like. No time for talks. When I say I trust your judgement, I suppose you give a good eye to the proposals (... and then blindly copy my wonderful improvements into live). -DePiep (talk) 02:10, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

OK, I'll move over the changes I'm ready to accept. Here's a somparison: YBG (talk) 02:44, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

Comparison of latest versions

Periodic table
Part of a series on the
Periodic table forms 18-column 32-column Alternative and extended forms
Periodic table history D. Mendeleev 1871 table 1869 predictions Discovery of elements Naming and etymology for people for places controversies (in East Asia) Systematic element names
Sets of elements
By periodic table structure Groups (1–18) 1 (alkali metals) 2 (alkaline earth metals) 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 (pnictogens) 16 (chalcogens) 17 (halogens) 18 (noble gases) Periods (1–7, ...) 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8+ Blocks (s, p, d, f, ...) Atomic orbitals Aufbau principle
By metallic classification Metals alkali alkaline earth transition post-transition lanthanide actinide Metalloids dividing metals and nonmetals Nonmetals nonmetal halogen noble gas
By other characteristics Coinage metals Platinum-group metals Precious metals Refractory metals Heavy metals Light metals Native metals Noble metals Main-group elements Rare-earth elements Transuranium elements Major, minor and trans- actinides
Elements
List of chemical elements by abundance (in human body) by atomic properties by isotope stability by symbol
Properties of elements Relative atomic mass Crystal structure Electron affinity configuration Electronegativity (Allen, Pauling) Goldschmidt classification Nutrition Valence
Data pages for elements Abundance Atomic radius Boiling point Critical point Density Elasticity Electrical resistivity Electron affinity / configuration Electronegativity Hardness Heat capacity / of fusion / of vaporization Ionization energy Melting point Oxidation state Speed of sound Thermal conductivity / expansion coefficient Vapor pressure
Category Chemistry Portal
v t e

Periodic table
Part of a series on the
Periodic table forms 18-column 32-column Alternative and extended forms
Periodic table history D. Mendeleev 1871 table 1869 predictions Discovery of elements Naming and etymology for people for places controversies (in East Asia) Systematic element names
Sets of elements
By periodic table structure Groups (1–18) 1 (alkali metals) 2 (alkaline earth metals) 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 (pnictogens) 16 (chalcogens) 17 (halogens) 18 (noble gases) Periods (1–7, ...) 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8+ Blocks (s, p, d, f, ...) Atomic orbitals Aufbau principle Other periodic table subsets Main-group elements Platinum-group metals Transuranium elements Major, minor and trans- actinides
By metallic classification Metals alkali alkaline earth transition post-transition lanthanide actinide Metalloids dividing metals and nonmetals Nonmetals nonmetal halogen noble gas
Other sets, named for ... ... element uses Coinage, precious, and refractory metals ... element properties Heavy and light metals Noble metals ... natural occurrence Native metals Rare-earth elements
Elements
List of chemical elements by abundance (in human body) by atomic properties by isotope stability by symbol
Properties of elements Relative atomic mass Crystal structure Electron affinity configuration Electronegativity (Allen, Pauling) Goldschmidt classification Nutrition Valence
Data pages for elements Abundance Atomic radius Boiling point Critical point Density Elasticity Electrical resistivity Electron affinity / configuration Electronegativity Hardness Heat capacity / of fusion / of vaporization Ionization energy Melting point Oxidation state Speed of sound Thermal conductivity / expansion coefficient Vapor pressure
Category Chemistry Portal
v t e

Comparison as of 02:44, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

special:permalink/708514977

Note: Something about including this inside a table seems to have interfered with the center justification, but eliminating the class=wikitable has fixed it. YBG (talk) 04:38, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

It looks fine. I'm not into perfecticising this one, keeping relaxed. -DePiep (talk) 19:01, 6 March 2016 (UTC)

One more question re cultural differences

There is one more thing I would like to know about the American perception of things. What do you and other Americans think of when they hear the word "ton(ne)"? How much is that? Does the article ton correctly explain the differences? In scientific contexts, do people ever think of tons as of metric units, or only when it is clearly stated, "metric tons"? How would you think of "ton" in this document?--R8R (talk) 14:06, 14 March 2016 (UTC)

And, of course, the question I forgot: if we say "metric ton" once, is it okay not to say the "metric" part in every consequent occurrence of the term and expect people to realize we're still talking in the metric unit?--R8R (talk) 14:11, 14 March 2016 (UTC)

The article ton seems to accurately reflect my understanding. I would presume the USGS article refers to 2,000 lb short tons. As to not repeating the 'metric', I'd have to think about that. One idea would be to say 'metric ton (tonne)' or something similar the first time and then say 'tonne' subsequently. Just a thought. Probably ought to consult WP:MOS for guidance and if there is none, then draft something to be included there. YBG (talk) 14:22, 14 March 2016 (UTC)

Thank you. My intention is to write articles accessible to most people in general. As one example of that, the article ununseptium (which I've brought to the FA status) introduces the reader into a few terms; this does make the article easier to read for those who aren't very good with the topic already, although another editor could assume the reader should know them or learn them elsewhere, given the technical nature of the article. I will check the MOS; if there's nothing useful, I'll probably want to ask you more about the alternatives.--R8R (talk) 14:49, 14 March 2016 (UTC)

Meanwhile, is "tonne" okay for AmE? I assume the Americans understand a vast majority of specifically British words and vice versa, but I still intend to write in AmE, even though I like to use words common for both AmE and BrE rather than AmE-specific ones when both kinds are available (again, accessibility), and if that word is not common in AmE, I'd rather stay out.--R8R (talk) 14:57, 14 March 2016 (UTC)

Don't know if this is merely idiosyncratic, but I put ton/tonne in a category with pound/kilogram rather than with center/centre or hood/bonnet or the like.

I'd be more than happy to weigh in on MOS alternatives. YBG (talk) 15:22, 14 March 2016 (UTC)

Interesting. I am a little confused now, because the article tonne says, "In the United States metric ton is the name for this unit used and recommended by NIST; an unqualified mention of a ton almost invariably refers to a short ton of 2,000 pounds (907 kg), and tonne is rarely used in speech or writing." (By the way, I assume the USGS article refers to the metric tons. I wondered for a while as well after I first saw the paper; but then I noticed the note that says, "Data in thousand metric tons of lead content unless otherwise noted".)

Unforntunately, the MOS has nothing to offer in this case at the moment. We're on our own.

It appears to me we'll have to go with "metric tons" (which is okay; everyone should be able to understand the term, be they British, American, or from elsewhere), but I am still uncertain whether we can skip the "metric" part in non-initial occurrences, and if so, if we should do so.--R8R (talk) 17:40, 14 March 2016 (UTC)

re USGS, if the footnote says they are referring to metric tons, then I believe them. But I didn't read the footnote, so I assumed short tons.

Yea, I suppose that it would be unusual in the US to say "tonne" instead of "metric ton", but I was suggesting that we use "metric tonne" as it would no doubt be highly approved by the Department of Repetitive Redundancy Department. By using "tonne" in subsequent mentions, it would be immediately understood by non-US readers and it would alert US readers that it was not what they would usually expect.

Here's some ideas for first and subsequent occurrences:

#	first mention	thereafter	comments
1	metric ton (tonne)	tonne	(what I suggested above)
2	metric ton (tonne)	tonne	(with wikilink & {{abbr}}
3	metric tonne	tonne	(eliminating the initial parenthetical aside)
4	metric ton	ton	(eliminating the tonne spelling)
5	metric ton	ton	(additional option)

I personally favor #2, but I expect you would favor #4. YBG (talk) 18:43, 14 March 2016 (UTC)

I hoped you'd miss the note, so I could get the initial thinking about tons.

It appeared to me first, and still does so after I read the description page of {{abbr}}, that it would not be right to use the template for ton. It also looks like an over-complication: we're talking about a common material, and the template makes the article look more difficult than it is. Besides, I wouldn't want to use it because of accessibility problems (touchscreens). Since you say "tonne" would be unusual in the context of AmE, it shouldn't be used (not to say some Americans can surely be unfamiliar with the fact "tonne" is actually different from "ton". I actually think it's safe to say many people won't think tonne/ton is not just a spelling difference). I guess we'll have to go with "metric ton/ton" if you agree too much "metric" won't be great.--R8R (talk) 14:25, 15 March 2016 (UTC)

Wow! So I passed the test because I didn't look closely. Now that's a switch!

Re spelling differences, I don't think the initial U.S. reaction to tonne would be "Oh, a spelling difference". I might be wrong, but I'd guess most are only aware of the er/re and or/our differences.

It's almost enough to make me want to switch the entire article to BrE.

To be realistic, in dealing with such large quantities, the 10% difference between the two ton and tonne isn't very significant.

Re using {{abbr}}, I know it has accessibility issues; I've run into this before when I wanted to (ab)use it. Sigh.

I've added another alternative to the above table. This also crosses the line a bit as it could be considered overlinking to use ton multiple times, but I think this might be one of the situations where it would be appropriate to WP:IAR. YBG (talk) 16:39, 15 March 2016 (UTC)

Sorry for a late reply.

There was no test; but this attitude is also fine :)

10% is significant. Not when you say speak about tons in general ("produced tons of lead," for example), but consider this sentence from the article: "World reserves—resources ready to be mined for which that would be economically feasible—totaled 89 million tons in 2015, of which Australia had 35 million, China had 15.8 million, and Russia had 9.2 million."

I think I came up with a great solution after I first read your reply. I speak about tons in two relatively short subsections: On Earth and Production and recycling. I can mention the units as "metric tons" at first occurrences in both sections, and use "tons" thereafter. Should be easy to read for American and British people alike, and no overlinking is needed. What do you think?--R8R (talk) 12:12, 19 March 2016 (UTC)

Sounds great! YBG (talk) 01:24, 20 March 2016 (UTC)

License plate articles

"Add current plate to top of article to prevent hovercard from showing blank plate."

Not saying your edits here are wrong, but... I don't get it. Bluebird207 (talk) 13:44, 2 May 2016 (UTC)

I have opted in to the hovercard beta feature so that when my cursor hovers over a link I see a preview of the article lede with the first picture. In most of the license plate articles, the first picture was file:Blank License Plate Shape.jpg, a most uninteresting picture. Hope this explanation helps. Cheers! YBG (talk) 13:59, 2 May 2016 (UTC)

Yes, this explanation certainly does help. Thanks. Bluebird207 (talk) 00:30, 3 May 2016 (UTC)

May 2016

The following comment is moved here to refactor my talk page:

Hello, you kindly deleted my message to Tewapack.

You support trolls? Or are you the same person?? Do you advocate providing false information on Wiki???

It was added by Golfeditor1 at 07:51, May 9 2016 (UTC)

My response is at user talk:Golfeditor1 § May 2016. YBG (talk) 08:49, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

Hello YBG,

thank you.

I understand your points, however it shouldn't require my publicly (and forever) publishing a copy of my ID and passport to substantiate points that require attention.

...when various personal information and links are wrong, then it should be self-evident to the editor in question.

I am not prepared to publish my identification documents.

Furthermore, in context of the comparisons you made, wrong portrayals can be deemed slanderous and pursued by litigation. If I were a politician or high-profiler that would be a certainty.

Regards Lincoln