Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 03:24, 4 October 2006

Archive 1

Badvertising

Hi, I created the badvertising article and have since noticed that it is tagged for clean-up and wikification. I wrote it pretty quickly and I know that certain aspects of it aren't encyclopaedic enough yet, but I was wondering what exactly you had in mind re the tagging? thank you. Saccerzd 14:55, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Status

Anyone looking for the latest status on the recent dispute, or wondering why on earth someone is calling me all kinds of names, the latest information is here. - Elonka 03:05, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

• June 2006 followup: --Elonka 22:26, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Articles I have created

For anyone interested in reviewing my editing history, these are articles I am particularly proud of:

• Raphael Kalinowski
• German liner Kronprinz Wilhelm
• Alfred Niezychowski
• Kim Zetter

And though I didn't create it, I've been substantially expanding the article on bestselling author Dan Brown.

- Elonka 18:52, 30 January 2006 (UTC)

• scratches head* Very odd situation indeed. I quickly went over your last 500 edits or so, and it looks ok from here. You did collide with dreamguy, but that's about it. I suppose bishonen is looking into the latter part. Terribly inconvenient this. Kim Bruning 09:43, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Thanks.  :) Elonka 14:10, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Salutations

Elonka - thanks for your clarity and thoughtful rewording of entries I've come across! I would say that I'm surprised that you have time with all your various interests, but I can't keep my fingers off Misplaced Pages either, and it seems to be a great place for people who care about information to hang out. So, nice to see you here! JustinHall 23:06, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

(Dia)critic(al)s

Hi Elonka, regarding Misplaced Pages:Naming conventions (standard letters with diacritics) you wrote:

To be effective, the proposal needs a simple "Summary" paragraph at the top with general rules, rather than immediately launching into complex language.

I tried to follow you suggestion (should have done that a long time ago...). Just inviting you to have a new look at the "diacritics" proposal, and see whether I managed to do what you suggested. Anyway, don't feel inhibited to improve the proposal, and/or communicate new criticisms on its talk page. tx. --Francis Schonken 10:26, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

Mediation Cabal

Hello! I just wanted to make sure you were aware of this mediation cabal case which probably includes you in some way. Your comments/opinions would be appreciated and I hope to see this resolved soon. Cheers! --Keitei (talk) 05:33, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

Dear Elonka, I am a Lithuanian editor of wikipedia, Juraune. I am editing wikipedia only just for more that a month, and consider myself to be not very much experienced there. I happened to read materials of so called "Polish Cabal". I want to share with you some of my concerns that might help you to prove the true nationalistic views of Halibutt and Piotrus. I don't know what to do with the name of the article Ethnic composition of Central Lithuania, created in a big part by Halibutt. The naming is very misleading, I think. It is not a geographical region of Central Lithuania in the year 2006. As I have found out, this Central Lithuania is a translation from Polish "Litwa Srodkowa", the "puppet" state that existed in 1920-1922, or at least a very controvercial state if I try to express myself with less Lithuanian POV. Currently the territory of this historical formation spreads in South East part of Republic of Lithuania, and western part of Republic of Bielarus, both being souvereigh countries. I don't know how to challenge Halibutt on renaming the article, since I cannot compete with him on the knowledge of millitary history. Also, I cannot compete with Piotrus, on his knowledge of rules and laws of wikipedia, but I think he is often mistaken by his naive and deep love of Poland, and I came to believe, he is sincere there. If you happen to know an administrator, who might be not biased in this case, could you let me know, I would like to see these articles renamed. Best wishes! Juraune 18:53, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

Misc

Hello Elonka! I just wanted to let you know that I've listened the episodes where you appeared on Binary Revolution Radio, and I was quite impressed. I've read quite a bit of your works, and I find it all to be very interesting, even inspiring, though a great deal of the mathematics of it escapes me.

I read the stuff about the "personal attacks" you had. I'm impressed with you, not impressed with Misplaced Pages. But you're right you know. The new users (like me) get the shaft, and longtime users can ignore whatever they want. Lame. It's almost as bad as politics. I'd like to give people like that a different kind of "personal attack."

Anyways, I guess I don't really have anything to say. Bye. --Othtim 05:54, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Re DreamGuy

"it is essential that the victims be above reproach, treat the situation with civility, and lay out a very clear documented case about what the problem is, so that a harried admin can see the problem. But as soon as the victims resort to name-calling or taunting (even if it's justified), the powers-that-be lose sympathy. ", which is why I told Centauri to cease from PAs. Erm yeah I agree with the majority of your comment. Englishrose 18:02, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Orb Wars

God did I love that game... good to finally see somebody else on this planet name-check it (even if it is one of the employees of the company who created the game :). I'd love to see a Misplaced Pages page on it. - Merzbow 21:57, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

Page moves

Hello, I noticed you've been proposing a lot of Poland-related page moves lately. In the future, would you mind advertising such proposals on the board? Cheers, Appleseed (Talk) 03:03, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

Perhaps those move requests could rather be informed to potentially interested Polish and other editors by messages to individual user talk pages... I wouldn't want to leave anyone out, not either those who do not follow the Polish-specific board. Maed 14:45, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

reply

hi. Been a couple of days away, and what bunch I then find in my talk page... Seems to be some overreaction. Those warnings are all too easy to drop. Please take a look at Talk:George I of Halych - what do you think of that naming? Maed 14:43, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

a small tip

elonka - i saw your exchange with mukadderat. he is a sock puppet of mikkala. just go see 'claves' which mukadderat features a picture of on his user page and to which mikkala has a rather close connection. seems strange he makes the connection so clear. (Unsigned comment added by Extremeweb, 08:39, June 24, 2006 )

Re:Slander

I certainly agree that this is a strong word and should be used with caution. However I believe I have the right to defend myself against the recent series of false accusations/misunderstandings/lies/etc. which can be summarized by the single word (slander). What other word would you propose I use to describe such activities? I am open for a 'politically correct' suggestions, but for now when I see wolf, I cry wolf. There is a treshold at which point such personal attacks as I have been facing recently stop being a nuisance I can ignore and hope that they go away and become serious enough that they start intefering with the work of myself and of others editors, and at that point I will not hesitate to address the matter; however unlike most of my opponents you will note that I don't engage in badmouthing other people in talk without providing evidence, but I pursue the WP:DR process. That said, have you considered addressing the incivility of editors such as Ghirla - or do you think that they have the right to make presonal attacks against me and I don't have the right to defend myself against them?--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 19:12, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

Defamation redirects to Slander and libel; but if you, a native speaker, think this is a less inflammatory term I will use it from now on. As for Ghirla, you say that I did not provide any evidence. I'd have think you'd stumble upon the evidence of his incivility several times (I have quoted it several times in the past few days), but in case you have missed it, would you prefer: set A (his RfC and the warning from ArbCom), set B (how he ignores and deletes warnings he receives from other people (, , - those are just three examples from the last few days, and they by no means represent any irregularity in his behaviour)), set C (his comments 1 and 3 at Misplaced Pages talk:Requests for comment/Irpen) or Set D - his contributions (please pay attention to edit summaries). I have to say I am very suprised that an editor such sensitive to civility and good conduct as you would defend Ghirla.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 19:39, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

It is my interpretation of some of your posts that you bring examples of how I criticize Ghirla's incivility and ignoring his incivil attacks you say that I am making personal attacks or being incivil (by being critical of him). Example 1: One individual who raised questions about the Polish issue was accused by Piotrus of a "racist attack" (now refactored, see our mediation case for source). Example 2: your latest thread on my userpage. I assumed (perhaps incorrectly?) that you disapproved of my usage of 'slander' at Misplaced Pages talk:Requests for comment/Irpen, where I used it to describe the evidently s... defamatory posts by Ghirla. If I was mistaken, and you don't approve of his action/tone/etc., perhaps you'd like to point it out at some place, especially considering how you criticized my critique of his "racial/ethnic attack" as mentioned above? If you could reform Ghirla, you'd do a great service to our community (as this is desired by scores of people, up to ArbCom members who issued him a warning).--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 19:58, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

As I have explained before, I should have said 'ethnic attack', not 'racial attack' - unfortunately I am not a native English speaker and in the heat of the moment I was mislead by a Polish language false friend ('rasista'). That said, I feel we disagree in interpretation of the severty of Ghirla's comment. To you, he only "presents a different POV". To me he suggests that people of Polish nationality have no right to vote, that everybody who opposes his POV is Polish (thus not worthy to vote), and that apparently Poles are engaged in an action to Polonize Misplaced Pages. I am sorry, but I find such a comment going way beyond 'presenting a different POV'. How would you feel if I said, for example, that "People of Polish descent leaving in US should have no right to vote on anything related to themselves, as they will obviously be biased and will try to influnce the vote, probably in some sinister attempt to polonize the US. Decisions related to people of Polish descent living in Poland should be made without consulting them and without their input, thus ensuring they will not influence the issue they are likely to influence otherwise."  ? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 20:35, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

Talk:Władysław II Jagiełło

Hi. It seems to me that an attempt to keep "oppose" votes at Jagello's naming as silent, is not succeeding. Rather, it seems to me that people are venting their Opposes to options they finf intolerable, supports to such which they really support, and there is a class between, apparently such options that could be tolerated but not outright supported. I am intending to change voting instruction there to reflect that behavior, seeing that your instruction is not accepted by participants. Shilkanni 21:24, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Yes, yes. But with Wladyslaw, we are stuck with differences of opinion on its spelling in English. I rather would see us with a solution without that name. Is is really necessary in the article name? The beginning of the article then tells about those names... You have seen it: nothing gets consensus, when there are two or more relevant ways to spell something (or corresponding situation: dates are still either NN Month or Month, NN; -ize/-ise ending terms are battlegrounds and the alternative usually is left which it was started with). This naming will have two almost equally-weighed camps in all situations, or worse, everything splits to several fragments. By the way, what do you predict will happen (result) in the current poll? Shilkanni 22:03, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Charlemagne solution

By the way, I have been looking at how this ruler is the most vexing of the whole lot. The more I think about the situation, the clearer it seems that all other rulers get solved a bit easier. (Why try this one among the first? As very little has been solved regarding others, there is not ebough to set parameters for this...) But, also it seems to me that as vexing this is, it benefits from a unique solution. Charlemagne is that here also because the less elements the name has, the less warring. HE would have been an object of affection as Charles I of France, Charles I of Germany, Emperor Charles I, Charles the Great of quite many kingdoms... and finally, truthfully, in his era's appellations, Charles I of the Franks. How willing would you be to accept a short name, either Jagello or Jagiello? And what do your books say? Shilkanni 21:42, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Your Request for Mediation

Hello, Elonka

My name is ^demon, and I am going to mediate the case that you requested concerning the episodes of Lost. Right now, before we continue, I would like to know if you prefer public or private mediation. If you could just let me know over at your request for mediation, I would be most grateful. Have a pleasant evening.

Regards,
^demon /02:52, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

Re: Scary Movie actors

No worries. We all miss a letter or two here and there. Dismas| 06:22, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

Re:Seeking a mediator

Good to know someone trusts me :) I can have a go, unless you've already got someone (like ^demon above?), though I still can't claim to be an expert at it! Petros471 08:06, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

Ok, thanks for letting me know. I'll probably leave that one then- as it's so long, it would be much better for the person already familiar with the situation to continue. I've got plenty of other things to be doing instead :) Petros471 20:12, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

RE: Peter

I'm not sure he's apologized for anything specific or general. It don't matter all that much to me at this stage; neither of us are constantly at each other's throat. Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 19:05, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

Disambiguated links using AWB

Minor nitpick: I thought that what you are doing is 'piping' (bypassing Misplaced Pages:Redirect), not 'disambiguating' (bypassing Misplaced Pages:Disambiguation).--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 23:20, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

I have long since given up on piping such redirects. Who knowns when somebody will move those pages yet again? Kudos for your work, but I am afraid it will not last long.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 23:36, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

I have decided to stop caring for now. Let naming fans fight over the naming schemes, I have content to create and articles to feature :) --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 23:49, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

First names I don't care that much about, and I never did (with the exception of some monstrosities like Ladislavus etc.). But Casimir or Sigismund are fine with me. What I do have the problem with is the omission of the nickname, very useful to casual reader, and the addition of mostly pointless and incorrect 'of Poland'. I make no promises other then when I will see the reason for move, I will use the WP:RM procedure, unlike some people (I don't mean you) who think they are above it.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 00:30, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

As a side effect you maybe causing damage to some articles. In the article on Jacob De la Gardie the text read:

De la Gardie took part in the Polish-Swedish War against his mother's half-brother King Sigismund III of Poland (former king of Sweden)

You changed this to:

''De la Gardie took part in the Polish-Swedish War against his mother's half-brother King Sigismund III Vasa (former king of Sweden).

Without knowing the history, it is very difficult for the reader to guess that the former king of Sweden was now in fact the king of Poland. -- Petri Krohn 06:45, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Pierre Plantard

For your information - Pierre Plantard was not an author or publisher.

All he did was write his beliefs on pieces of paper by typewriter and deposit this material in the Bibliotheque Nationale - that does not make him an "author" or a "publisher",

Paul Smith (Posted 11:46, July 4, 2006 by User:195.92.168.170)

Response

The original research policy exists to deal with the likes of crank theories and unverifiable information. It does not, however, deal with information which is (I assume, and no one has actually disputed this), evident to anyone who visits the site. Such information is informative and useful, and it is ridiculously overzealous to remove it on those grounds. Rebecca 23:18, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Then perhaps you should read don't disrupt Misplaced Pages to make a point. If you want the article deleted, you're welcome to express your opinion on that. You're not welcome, however, having failed to do the above, to disrupt the rest of the article by making silly demands. If the article is a "promotional POV sentence", then what on earth is it supposed to be promoting? You've not given one single reason to suggest that either a) it is wrong, or b) it is not obvious to anyone who visits the site. This does not require a source. Rebecca 23:32, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

If only that actually made any sense. "Treasure hunter" status? All the sentence describes is the current state of the street. Rebecca 23:54, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

The article doesn't say that Hitler's bunker was on Voss-strasse. It says that the Reich Chancellery was on Voss-strasse. Again, the objection to the sentence makes no sense. Rebecca 00:54, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

I've chipped my two cents in here. Greetings, Blur4760 18:18, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

Peace offering

I stumbled upon some articles you might be interested in: pl:Duninowie, pl:Stary Duninów, pl:Duninów Duży, pl:Nowy Duninów, pl:Gmina Nowy Duninów.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 22:18, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

I thought you may not be aware of them. Currently I think I will be translating the pl:Sejm grodzieński. I just need to find some English language references for verification.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 22:25, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

Early Medieval Poland is not my forte, but translation is not difficult: I'll add it to my 'to do' queue, especially as it has enough material for a handsome DYK. Although as is often the case with pl wiki, the creator(s) did not bother with referencing the article... :( PS. His nickname, 'Dunin', is from a legend that he came from Denmark (in Polish, 'Dania', and 'Dane' is 'Duńczyk'). Still, his descendants adopted that for their surname. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 22:43, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

Beginning Mediation

Dear Elonka,

After requesting the preference of mediation, the consensus appears to be public, with one person not responding (and has appeared to have left the project for the time being), and one person abstaining due to being away for the summer. This being decided, let us begin. I figure the easiest place to centralize all discussion can be the talk page of the RfM. Thanks for your time, and if you'll go there now, you'll see that I've begun a discussion on the topic. Thanks very much.

-^demon /11:34, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

No problem!

Hello! I have no bad thoughts about your edits completely. I am perfectly aware that the monarchs case issues are very complex, so all editors should work hard to produce the best possible salutations. What I did was only adjustments to your huge contribution.

Keep up with your contributions! Cya. M.K. 13:02, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

re: Misplaced Pages:Selected anniversaries/January 20 & RfA

Hiya, there's a link on this page that needs to be disambiguated (details at Wikipedia_talk:Selected anniversaries/January 20). I see that you were one of the last people to tweak that part of the page, can you please adjust it? Also, I'm considering applying for admin access so that I can get in to do these kind of janitorial things... Do you think I'd have a good case? --Elonka 22:02, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the quick turnaround!  :) --Elonka 22:38, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Oh, you are welcome, Elonka. I just happen to be in.

About the "wikimop".... I don't pay attention to RfA these days, so I don't know what the standards are now. You may want to check out Misplaced Pages:Guide to requests for adminship. You may also want to take part in the voting at RfA now and make some friends there. It will help. Looks like you have a good track record. Keep up the good work and one of your wikifriends will nominate you soon. Good Luck. --PFHLai 22:57, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Third opinion is requested

Hi, Elonka! Could I ask you to comment on the following situation?

I found a comment on the page Talk:Ukrainization by User:Irpen which, IMHO, is unrelated to the subject of the article. In accord with WP:NPA,

I decided to move the comment to AndriyK's talk to keep the discussion at Talk:Ukrainization free from personal attacks and focussed on the topic of the article. But Irpen restored the comment .

I need an opionion of a neutral person, whether I was right or wrong when I was moving this comment. In the case I was wrong, what is the right way to keep the article talk focused on the subject? Flooding it with unrelated stuff makes it difficult to read and follow the discussion. Here is another example : Irpen moved a long discussion from his talk to the Talk:Russian architecture. What is the best way to deal with it? I tried to contact Irpen but got a very unpleasant answer.

Thanks in advance.--Mbuk 14:04, 8 July 2006 (UTC)

My entry was not at all a personal attack. To dismiss the valid criticism as a personal attack is an old tactic. However, I always welcome more opinions on any issue. More here. --Irpen 06:40, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Cities and towns in Italy

I'm doing the towns now. If you want to do the cities, that would be great. Thanks. Vegaswikian 06:24, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

I also noticed the "paired" subcategories, like "Cities in Abruzzo" and "Towns in Abruzzo". I'd suggest doing an umbrella nom for all of the city and town categories to rename them to Category:Cities and towns in foo. Might as well clean up all of them and not just the paired ones. Vegaswikian 08:23, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

The use of words 'like' and 'probably' lead me to say that the intent was not clear to include these. On the other hand, if, as it seems likely, combining those categories would not meet any opposition it would be reaasonable to create the new categories and then move everything into them. The fact that you saw the intent of the CfD to include those and I did not should not be a big issues. Especically since the problem becomes clear only after you merge the parent category and I did notice that. If you go do the move, let me know when you are done and I'll add the category redirects. I think the redirects should be left here since it is too likely that someone will recreate the old cats in the future. Vegaswikian 18:06, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

It would surely be best to combine all of these paired categories - there is no differentiation between what qualifies as a "city" and what is a "town" in any of these and I was hoping to eventually standardise all of the Italian geography categories into "Cities and towns in ..." There are twenty regions of Italy, most of which have double city/town categories, and there are also duplicate categories like Category:Coastal towns in Italy and Category:Coastal cities in Italy- AKeen 05:00, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Sounds good, I'll start helping to combine. Also, thanks for noticing this and helping set the move in motion. - AKeen 05:16, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

In terms of categorization, Italy is subdivided into 20 regions which are then further subdivided into smaller administrative units called provinces. Following the template of Sicily (one of the regions of Italy), each region, for example, Campania, should have a parent category for the whole region Category:Cities and Towns in Campania, which is then filled with categories for each province in the region:Category:Municipalities of the Province of Salerno, Category:Municipalities of the Province of Avellino, etc. For regions other than Sicily (Campania, Liguria, Veneto, etc), the next level of organization hasn't begun yet, eg towns in Campania have not been categorized into their proper province, but this can't be accomplished until there is a single parent category for the entire region instead of both Category:Towns in Campania and Category:Cities in Campania into which the province categories can be put.

I think the main issue at this time is fixing the parent categories for each region. The province categories (Municipalities of the province of...") can be tackled once the moves are completed. No region other than Sicily has categories for provinces yet. -AKeen 12:58, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Isn't "commune" the appropriate term for Italian municipalities? john k 00:42, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

Polish stuff

Hello, I posted on the mediation page, as requested, trying to indicate that I did object at the time. At the same time, don't you think it might be wise to back off the whole thing a little? I've worked with Piotrus a lot, and I genuinely think he is a well-intentioned user who is trying to improve wikipedia. I've also gotten into a lot of arguments with him, and disagreed with him about a ton of things, and I don't like the way the Polish monarchs move went down. But I think that Piotrus has done enough useful things for the project to warrant being given the benefit of the doubt in terms of acting in good faith, and I think escalating the thing into a personal conflict between the two of you (which, of course, he has been as much responsible for as you, as far as I can tell), and so forth, is only counter-productive. It is possible to disagree about content, and even to very strongly disagree, without it getting to the level of an enormously lengthy mediation page. I'm not sure what, at this point, would settle the issue, or even what the issue precisely is at this moment. I don't think Piotrus abused any admin privileges in carrying out the moves. While deleting redirects while making moves is, I suppose, technically an admin privilege, it is a pretty meager one, and I don't think that such a thing would be cause for de-sysopping. Beyond that, I'm not sure what admin privileges Piotrus would have violated - he isn't being accused of deleting actual articles, of inappropriately protecting or unprotecting pages, or of inappropriately blocking users, is he? john k 00:42, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

Hello

Elonka;

Pardon the intrusion, but are you be any chance a countess? ;) Charles 04:00, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply, Elonka! I am very sorry to here about the circumstances of your father and his parents... Was the title one held by the head of the family (i.e. was your father the Count?)? In the United States, I find that titles are a peculiar situation. The are sometimes seen as offensive but desired, for right and wrong reasons. It is interesting to note (and I am a bit foggy on this matter) that American citizens are allowed to hold titles, only if they don't receive them while in a public office. My opinion is that your heritage is a very wonderful thing that transcends the laws of a country (and the non-use of a title is solely up to you). I come into contact with nobles from time to time as a social group and observe the traditions that marked a very colourful duration of history. My own family is of German noble descent and I take great interest in the practices and circumstances of the past. Charles 20:12, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

On this page they have an entry for Dunin-Borkowski with note under Borkowski Wlodomir-Maria was granted the Austrian title of count by Francis Joseph on May 15th, 1866. He died without issue. The house of Dunin, from links followed on your page, appears to be divided into various sublines with one named Dunin and the others named Dunin with a differencing name. If any of your male-line ancestors received a German title, then you and all of your agnatic relatives would be entitled to that title as well.

My own family is almost exclusively German on the male side and French/British Isles on my mother's side. The only Polish relations I have married into the family. Although, if you do have extensive German ancestry from around the Rhine, it could be possible. I wish I could help identify the portraits, but I am *just* starting to get into Polish nobility... The language barrier is something I am trying to overcome or at least work around. I don't have a published or even compiled family tree because there is a lot of paperwork left to go through and some more searching. My family is very private and as far as I know, my great-grandfather's descendants are the only ones of us left. Charles 22:20, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Elonka Dunn Page

Is it just me but do you recognise the editing style of the person vandalising the Elonka Dunn page, could it be someone who is back with a grudge? Englishrose 09:02, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Probably revenge for enforcing the sockpuppet tag? At a guess. Think of it this way, which user would defintley your article without having a grudge against you. I know your notable en all, lol, but who would type in Elonka Dunin and intentionally try and vandalise the aritcle? People are more likely to target articles such as George W Bush and Hitler etc. Englishrose 19:25, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

Ships

Thanks for your consistent work on SMS Karlsruhe (1912) and others.--mervyn 12:43, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

Of interest, perhaps

Misplaced Pages:Newbie experiment, Template:Newbie1 (note AfD), Template:Newbie.--Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus 05:36, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

My RfA thanks

Hello Elonka, and thank you for your support at my Request for Adminship, which succeeded with an overwhelming final count of (105/2/0). I was very pleased with the outpouring of kind words from the community that has now entrusted me with these tools, from the classroom, the lesson in human psychology and the international resource known as Misplaced Pages. The 💕. Your constructive criticism was helpful and insightful and I will keep it in mind... It's interesting that you thought I had improved in the intervening weeks, when I can't say I had been faced with a similar situation before or since. Please feel free to leave me plenty of requests, monitor my actions (through the admin desk on my userpage) and, if you find yourself in the mood, listen to some of what I do in real life. In any case, keep up the great work and have a fabulous day. Grandmasterka 06:27, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

Renaming

I agree! But if you want a biographical entry to be named by their penname, you should close off the fullname by making it a redirect to their penname. That will prevent a move to the fullname by anyone, and let people know you have used the truncated name as a deliberate decision. Everyone knows Bill Clinton and J.R.R. Tolkien but not everyone will be an expert on every great author. E. O. Wilson is the main page and Edward Osborne Wilson was created as a redirect. That way everyone knows that it is not an oversight, or that the page was created before people knew what the E and O stood for. Another way to handle a penname is to mention it in the text such as "Ernst Theodor Wilhelm Hoffmann (January 24, 1776 in Königsberg, East Prussia, Prussia–June 25, 1822 in Berlin, Brandenburg, Prussia), better known by his pen name “E. T. A. Hoffmann”, was a Romantic author of fantasy and horror, a jurist, composer, music critic, draftsman and caricaturist." Cheers. --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) 18:09, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

User:Misza13's pile!

Thank you for contributing the impressive the pile of supports gathered on my RfA, which passed with a final tally of 0x0104/0x01/0x00. I'm happy that so many people have put faith in my abilities as an admin and promise to use the tools wisely and do my best not to let you down. If I ever may be of assistance, just leave a note on my talk page. Misza13, the rouge-on-demand admin wishes you happy editing! NOTE: This message has been encrypted with the sophisticated ROT-26 algorithm. Ability to decipher it indicates a properly functioning optical sensor array.

Professionalism

I saw your comment on the talk page of administrator Tony Sidaway, as well as his less than friendly reply. Startling...Andrés C. 03:12, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

Agreed.  :/ --Elonka 03:49, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

Re: Teamwork

Hello! I kind of noticed you stalking me, your name appearing in articles after I have tagged them ;-) I sometimes think "Poor Elonka, I do the easiest part, tagging the article as uncategorized, and leave her to search around for correct categories." Wish I could do more, but I am pretty bad at categorizing or stubbing. Currently I am working with the orphan lists, Special:Lonelypages and Misplaced Pages:Dead-end pages, sometimes the New pages log, and the recent changes ones. -- ReyBrujo 21:58, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

Voivodeships

Hello. I noticed that my bot was picking up Voivodeship category redirects; I checked it out, came across the CFD and thought it had better be closed! You have taken on a fiddly job there! When you want those categories deleted just leave me a note on my talk page and I'll do it when I get round to it. If you have voivodeship categories that need moving then let me know on my talk page rather than trying to move all the articles individually; one incarnation of my bot can move the category's content, then move all the articles, and then leave a note for me to delete the old one (or it can automatically leave a category redirect if that's what I tell it). Alternatively you can list it on Misplaced Pages:Categories for discussion/Working in the appropriate section and another of the CFD bots will do it. Keep up the good work! Regards, RobertG ♬ talk 19:43, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, I don't have a bot that will rename articles! I have a question about the categories: do you see any reason why we need to keep the old categories as redirects now that they're empty, or shall I delete them? Category moves don't usually resort to category redirects, unless the consensus is to convert to a category redirect. I've been happy to do the Voivodship categories that way because it makes it easier for you, given the consensus among the "Polish" Wikipedians. --RobertG ♬ talk 12:14, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

The categories have gone, but I need to ask you to remove the "x redirects here" messages, please; I haven't time to program my bot to do that, I'm afraid! Best wishes, RobertG ♬ talk 08:46, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Civility comment

Considering your appreciation for WP:CIV, I wonder if you would like to comment here or at the page the comment was made?-- _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus  talk}  17:12, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

I thought about Cvility Noticeboard, but it was deleted and I am actually at loss as to where report incivility (unless one wants to start a mediation). Why WP:ANI, though? Do you think this requires the intervention of an admin? I usually don't favour blocking for single incivil remarks, but Ghirla with his several-year long history of thousands of such edits probably is a separate case...-- _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus  talk}  17:22, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

Isn't it nice to see Ghirla taking your words to heart?-- _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus  talk}  16:59, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for taking a stance. Hopefully now the editing atmosphere will clear a little. Say, are you involved with WP:CCD? I think it is a project that would strike your fancy.-- _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus  talk}  17:33, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Yes, I've participated in the talk page discussion, though I'm not sure that the entity has sufficient critical mass to do much good. --Elonka 17:36, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

And now it seems you have been accused of being a 'perpetrator of nationalistic crap' (because you dated to criticize Ghirla). Welcome to my world, and remember: no good deed....-- _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk}  22:47, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

I don't recall him posting there recently. I think he voted there few times, but didn't post comments - or I don't recall them, and I don't think I am involved in content dispute with all of the editors who voted different then me. And besides, I think content dispute exists when people edit main article and revert and stuff, not when they hash stuff out at talk without editing the main article (and I don't think I edited that article in weeks).-- _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk}  04:45, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Little Note

I am very much impressed by your efforts to mediate Jagiello/Jogaila issue... Ever considering working for UN? :) Renata 20:11, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

It's very dangerous work, especially these days. Take a pass, please!

Thanks, Elonka for remaining fair and giving us all an example worth emulating in this dispute concerning the founder of the "J" Dynasty. Dr. Dan 05:00, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

History of Lithuania

Dear Elonka, I really admire you for your achievements and, especially, that you go for a compromise and are able to change your oppinion. There was never my intention to mock you, I don't know why Halibutt or SylviaS got this idea. As for Halibutt, he disrupts the work of Lithuanian editors, and polonises all the names that are not King names the way he finds it desirable without regard to others. Also, I want to ask you to add Lithuania related stub categories in the history articles, where you think it is pertinent. Sincerely, Juraune 13:53, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Please don't close RM votes by yourself

While I don't support move wars, Balcer has the right to start an RM poll; it should not be closed. I would ask you (as I did on the article talk page) to revert yourself and allow the poll to continue.-- _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk}  21:42, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

We can't have two polls on the go at the same time, can we? I know the result in the current poll doesn't currently look good for you, Piotrus, but it may change. Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 21:47, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

Re:

I haven't really thought about it Elonka. I've no idea why you oppose Jogaila, but you've maintained integrity and I think you can be trusted to exercise good faith, so I don't really care why you oppose it. I know at least that you aren't a fanatic, and hence I know discussion with you won't be a pointless exercise. To be honest, I'm sick to the teeth with Jogaila. After all, it is just a page name, and every second I spend on it, I lose a second on something more useful, either on wiki or in my personal life. I share with you the desire to end this. But what I don't want is a biased name determined by a nationalistic "cabal". I'd be happy with any outcome so long as it is not produced in this manner. Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 17:50, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

I honestly can't think of an uncumbersome name likely to be acceptable. My best choice would be Jogaila, but Wladyslaw II Jagiello obviously lacks the diacritics so many hate, and is certainly better than the old name. I did once suggest the name Jogaila (Wladyslaw II). But generally naming patterns for Polish monarchs has to be agreed first I'd have thought. E.g. if Wladyslaw here, then Wladyslaw everywhere, not Ladislaus for one, Vladislav for another, etc. Also, what is the deal with the "of Country" format. Many articles were moved back to that format, and now it's all inconsistent. Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 18:47, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

AWB

Just a technical note: perhaps you could set your AWB to mark minor changes as such. Recently I saw my entire watchlist filled with your changes and, to be frank, all of them were in fact minor. It was a tad tiresome to browse through three pages of watch list, and trying to find what is actually an interesting diff and what's simply a technical change of a single word with AWB. Cheers. //Halibutt 12:14, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, sort of ;> //Halibutt 12:30, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

John III and other rulers of Poland

Hi again Elonka. Now, Jan III Sobieski is currently the only ruler of Poland/Poland-Lithuania to have the name John, instead of Jan. It used to be John, John III Sobieski, King of Poland, but Piotrus moved it. Should we try to get it moved back to John, this time John III Sobieski, or just leave it. Further point, what is going to be done about the inconsistencies in Polish monarch names, such as one X n of Poland but another Y n Nickname of Poland, do you think there is a need to standardize these names? Regards, Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 21:19, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

Thanks. The Henrys were also move a the turn of the last year, from Henrys to Henryks, e.g. Henryk I the Bearded, Henryk II the Pious Henryk IV Probus. Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 14:13, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

Voivodeships

No problem, and thanks for your dedicated work toward updating everything. Olessi 23:45, 29 July 2006 (UTC)

Gender

Thank you for your kind help. The gender question was really creating some unessecary confussion, so I did my best to correct this situation on my user page and to explain my position. I also explained that I am a Roman Catholic, and by no means a Pagan, since some might have drawn this conclussion from my 'fierce' defence of 'Pagan Empire' :) Too bad that I do not have the time to do real edits of history articles :( Still, there is a lot of time ahead for that, I try to be optimistic. Best wishes. Juraune 18:35, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

May be of interest - Book of Cool entry.

I just added some more to the above. Extremeweb 10:30, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

Don't add template:hoax

Before engaging your brain.

Heard of Google? — Dunc|☺ 19:23, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

Right, so multiple accounts and anons from different IPs have been posting misinformation, across several only vagueley related articles have they? Have you checked they haven't changed the definition of paranoia too? — Dunc|☺ 19:32, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

Thank you

Hello! Thank you for participating in my RfA! Unfortunately, it ended with a final result of (32/31/5) which no consensus was achieved. Nevertheless, I'd like to thank you again for your comments and to keep an eye out for me within the next 3 months. If you would like to give any helpful advice, please contact me via my suggestions page for my next RfA. :)

RfA

Hey, it's me again. Check it out. I've been nominated for admin. I hope you vote. Thanx. íslenska hurikein #12 _(samtal) 19:10, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

DNB, s.n.

Fairly standard form for the (Oxford) Dict. of Nat. Biography, under the name in question, since it confirms most or all of what you wrote; feel free to expand. (and to comment on my RfA, if you like.)Septentrionalis 21:31, 12 August 2006 (UTC)

Meissen

Hi Elonka;

You were involved in the discussions over the use of diacritics in the names of Polish kings. Do you have an opinion on the use of diacritics in the names of German cities (in this case, ß in the name of Meissen)? There is a discussion at Talk:Meissen and if you'd care to add your opinion, whatever it may be, it may contribute to settling the issue. Thanks. Charles 23:35, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

I've commented on the Countess of Dalhousie's AfD nomination. A side note, I attend a university names for one of her husband's predecessors. Also, completely unrelated to Meissen and Dalhousie, but related to titles in the US, I found the reference to foreign titles in the US constitution. I thought it might interest you:

No title of nobility shall be granted by the United States: and no person holding any office of profit or trust under them, shall, without the consent of the Congress, accept of any present, emolument, office, or title, of any kind whatever, from any king, prince, or foreign state.

There are no other articles or sections in the constitution regarding foreign titles. Charles 00:21, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

thanks

For your quick and thorough response to the {{Uncategorized}} template on Dan Leibovitz. --M@rēino 20:01, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

Civility question

Since your advice was so useful last time, I wanted to show you this little 'gem': and ? I wonder if this falls under WP:NPA? Either way it is not something I intend to pursue now (I don't care much what grafitti one posts on their user space), but I wonder what do you think about it?-- _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk}  19:30, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

Piotrus, as I told you before, if you want to pursue smth, go for it. If not, cool it. You choose both, claiming that you are "not pursuing" and spreading this all around at the same time in order to make the situation even more inflammatory and achieve your dream to have your opponent blocked even, this time, by digging out links from four weeks ago to resurrect the old conflict. So, either "pursue" this and make sure you do it within an appropriate time frame, or cool it off. --Irpen 20:00, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

Irpen, as I told you, ignoring a problem is not going to make it go away. Your behaviour is really saddening - instead of constructive comments you are acusing me of bad faith. After our meeting I hoped for a better response...-- _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk}  08:55, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

Piotrus, let's start with the facts: you and Ghirla... well... let's say that you're not exactly the best friends in the known universe. There can be a multitude of reasons for that, and I'm not saying you or Ghirla bear entirely the responsibility of it. I'm only looking at the result.

AFAIK and as you said yourself, you're only seldom editing the same articles and seldom get in contact with each other. Why not drop everything and just not get in contact? You're writing your articles, he's writing his own, you both contribute to en encyclopedia and that's just fine.

Pointing out such things just for the sake of pointing them out is kinda unnecessary. Instead of settling the matter, you keep on throwing gaz into the fire.

Maybe you should forgot for a second that you're an admin and stop willing to perform some kind of justice at all costs. Just my 2 cents. -- Grafikm 15:23, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

Well, I think everybody needs to cool down and not transform a flea into an elephant (like I said when the "Poles-holes" incident was discussed)... -- Grafikm 20:04, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

Press citation in syndicated column

What do you recommend for WP:PRESS in the case of a syndicated column? For example, Dan Savage's syndicated column in this week's issue of the Metro Times "damns" Misplaced Pages for making it tough for him to lie about his age. Robert Happelberg 23:42, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

Image:MichaelBaigent.jpeg listed for deletion

Scottish monarchs

A similar situation to our previous one with Polish monarchs appears to have arisen in the articles on a number of medieval Scottish monarchs. Duncan I of Scotland is now Donnchad I of Scotland, and his son Malcolm III has been moved to Máel Coluim III of Scotland. This was done, so far as I can tell, with no discussion whatsoever (oddly enough, by User:Calgacus, whom you may recall as having been rather strongly opposed to the usage of Polish names way back when). Anyway, I don't know if you're interested, but a discussion is ongoing at Talk:Máel Coluim III of Scotland. The basic answer Calgacus and Angus McLellan have so far provided to the question of "How can this possibly be justified under the naming conventions" appears to be "We don't care." john k 14:39, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

Moves

I have no problem you moving these pages now, but it'd have been better to have waited until voting ends. Anyways, you should move the talk pages also. There's a box you need to tick to do that below the move rectangle, you always need to make sure that is ticked. PS, the vote is not a consensus, it's two camps of relatively unreconcilable viewpoints; just because one camp got more voters to the page does not mean it's consensus. Regards, Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 01:52, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

Oh dear, Elonka, did you actually read that? If you did, then you'll need to explain to me why you posted it for me. I am assuming, for once, good faith. Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 02:14, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

OK, one, what's all that got to do with "consensus"; and how does that explain the link you posted? Two, my calling those articles childish and 20 years out of date was because, well, they are childish and 20 years out of date; not because they "disagreed with my position" (we could go over this if you like, just in case you think I'm being dishonest). Three, I'm entitled to move pages and edit articles without holding a mass poll everytime I do it; if my perception of potential opposition was flawed, then it was flawed - but that's it. You can be sure I wouldn't have moved them if I'd known how much time it would have sucked up. I see the similarities with the Piotrus action now that you point it out, but I promise I was acting in all innocence. Four, my attitude towards busyboddies and convention obsessives is entirely related to how often I have to read them pontificate. Be sure that this is as irritating and respect-losing for me as my somewhat abrassive argumentative style is for you. As for the latter, I've noticed this has been increasing over time on wikipedia. I'm really a nice guy. I just maybe need to take a break from all this antagonism; I've been in this argument for several days flat now. The promptness and comprehensiveness, as you relate, with which I respond, probably doesn't help as it gives me little relief. Anyways, maybe in future I'll need to manage my stress levels on wiki talk pages. If we should be crossing paths again, you can maybe give me a bell if you see starting to get extremely rude without obvious provocation. Regards, Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 02:48, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, already at it. Had to move a page in my own space to find out where the check function way. How 'bout I do the Domnalls and Donnchads, you do the Cináeds and Mael Coluims? Some of the other talk pages may need fixing too btw. Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 04:15, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

BTW, User:Angusmclellan has a device that allows him to fix the article links very quickly. He'll prolly attend to that when gets back (at least he always volunteers this duty). Calgacus (ΚΑΛΓΑΚΟΣ) 04:23, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

{{Blp}}

Hi. Please note that there's no living=yes parameter to template {{Blp}}. Looks like your occasional usage of this param has caught my bot out :)

If the article is a bio, please use {{WPBiography|living=yes}}. If it's a list or some other non-biographical article about living people, please use {{Blp}} without parameters.

Thanks very much, no reply needed. --kingboyk 10:31, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

Uncat-date

Hi, thanks for doing so much tagging, just thought I'd mention that the template inserts the category as well, so there is no need to manually add the category as well. thanks. Martin 08:15, 31 August 2006 (UTC)

Ok great, as long as there is a method to your madness ;-) But are you sure that the special page ignores embedded template categories? I was under the impression it didn't. Either way, I have also been tagging articles, but from scanning the database dump instead, I have been working backwards through the alphabet (i.e. the opposite of the special page). Martin 19:02, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Enable the "Are regexes" option, then skip if contains "\

Invite to Misplaced Pages:Libel-Protection Unit

Biographies of Living Persons WP:BLP requires a higher wikipedia standard since the Siegenthaler Controversy in December 2005. Articles like these involve WP:LIBEL and WP:NPOV It has been 6 months, and wikipedia still has hundreds of potentially libelious articles.

Many editors and even administrators are generally unaware of potential defamation either direct or via WP:NPOV. To help protect wikipedia, I feel a large working group of historians, lawyers, journalists, administrators and everyday editors is needed to rapidly enforce policies.

I would like to invite you to join and particpate in a new working group, tenatively named Misplaced Pages:Libel-Protection Unit, a group devoted to WP:BLP, WP:LIBEL and WP:NPOV and active enforcement. From your experience and/or writings on talk pages, I look forward to seeing you there. Electrawn 16:32, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Haven't had an email from you recently, regarding non-wikipedia issues, either. :( Electrawn 16:32, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Pazmaneum and Péter Pázmány

Pazmaneum is a school, the Collegium Pazmaneum, a Catholic seminary founded in 1623 by Péter Pázmány for Hungarian students in Vienna. Pázmány was a big figure in the Counter-Reformation, archbishop, primate of Hungary, and also founded the first Hungarian university in 1635, which still survives in Budapest. But him being a Catholic archbishop, he is probably not your ancestor :-) See also: http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/11595c.htm

The surname is likely related to the Hont-Pázmány clan (also Hont-Pázmán, Hunt-Pázmán, Huntpázmány), which has an interesting history. According to the chronicles, the brothers Hont and Pázmán were Swabian (i.e. German) knights, who came to Hungary in the 10th century. They received huge tracts of land in what is today Western Slovakia, and the county Hont. They were the ancestors (documented from the 13th century) of a large number of noble families in Hungary, e.g. Forgách, Batthyány, Kővári, Bánki, Lázár, Ujhelyi, Szentgyörgyi and many more. Perhaps this gives you a starter...Hollomis 02:10, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

1. Need to consult genealogy sources

Re:Talk:Allegations of state terrorism by United States of America/strawpolls

Thanks for adding tag, I was looking for this moved section, and I had just asked a user not one minute before what happened to this section.

And like an angel, you answered my question by adding the unref tag. :) Thanks. Travb (talk) 02:04, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

advertising is not a CSD criterion

Elonka, advertising is not a speedy deletion criterion (at present). Please use prod or AFD for advertisement cases. -- nae'blis 20:04, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your dilligence; one more thing you may or may not have been aware of. Prod tags cannot be replaced once removed (unless the removal was part of a vandalism blanking or the like). Any reason, or in fact no stated reason at all, is sufficient to move things on to the next stage. In the ad:tech case, I actually stubbed the article out and added some information, since it seems to be a worldwide player in that market (albeit with some serious press releases/media saturation going on). Cheers. -- nae'blis 18:45, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

Ed Seykota

Hey thanks for your note. I think the bibliography on Ed's article is way too long, don't you think? --Mantanmoreland 03:34, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

Really? I shall go back and take a look. I have never heard of this fellow. Yes there seems to be a problem with autobiographical edits. This guy doesn't run a basketball team too, does he?--Mantanmoreland 03:39, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

Zowie! I looked at the edit history. I see what you mean. I strongly suggest you post a note in Request for Administrator Attention. I really wouldn't know where to start in cutting back the puffery in this article. I suggest that since you are familiar with the subject matter, that you be bold. I will watch.--Mantanmoreland 03:43, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

I shall look at those other articles. You know, that Seykota article is really a case of tail wagging the dog. --Mantanmoreland 03:51, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

Re:Mediation

Hi Elonka! Of course I would like to help- however, I'm going to have to decline this one, as I'm also pretty busy working in real life. I notice that Thatcher131 has volunteered, so hopefully something can be sorted out. Petros471 08:56, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Your suggestion

(preserving what you wrote on my talk page, for continuity): Hiya, I've been giving a lot of thought to the consensus issue, truly. I still disagree with you about whether or not consensus exists, but I've been trying to think of how else we might test this, since we haven't had any luck getting a mediator. What I was thinking was this: In your view, the season articles should stay, and the episode articles should get deleted, right? So about how we submit one of the episode articles for deletion via AfD, and get opinions that way? It'll be a good way to get other opinions, to have a community debate, and get a clear admin ruling. I'd be willing to abide by whatever the decision was, and apply it to the other episodes as well. Would you be willing to agree with that? If so, we could post the suggestion on the mediation page, and if the others sign off as well, we'd have a way out of this logjam.  :) --Elonka 20:00, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the creative suggestion, but I'm very opposed. We don't need "other opinions" on a very narrow slice of the issue here, as in "how about we delete this one episode". You'll get tons of people, justifiably, simply wondering why we'd want to delete a perfectly good article, and hardly any of them will read the already overwhelming discussion that exists about the underlying issues here. This would be an excellent way of bolstering your side, especially with respect to your view that majority opinion should prevail, but a) I can predict the outcome; and b) I don't think it would further any of the season article people's sense that it's the correct outcome.

We need a mediator. Why the heck can't we seem to get one? -- PKtm 20:26, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Answering your question about whether I'd accept Thatcher as a moderator: my apologies; somehow I thought that you were opposed to Thatcher, so I hadn't dug into his background etc., since it didn't seem worthwhile if we were in disagreement from the start. I've now done so, and he looks fine from all I can tell. He's certainly an experienced WP editor with lots of administrative experience, even if not an admin per se, so he's clearly grappled with WP policy issues before. Please chime in with your vote, if you agree, and I'll follow suit. -- PKtm 00:12, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

Lost disambiguating

A question: What is your opinion of disambiguation of TV episodes as a whole? Disambiguate them for consistency (e.g. Live Together, Die Alone), or, if no alternative exists, or is the most notable subject, giving it the unparathenticated title (e.g. Stupid Spoiled Whore Video Playset)? Will 19:31, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

WP:NC(GN)

I apologize for spamming your talk page, but since you had contributed in the past to the WP:NC(GN) proposal, which is currently ready for a wider consultation, I thought you might want to give it another look now and, hopefully, suggest some final improvements. Thanks. --Lysy 22:58, 18 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for sharing!

Your thoughts about Misplaced Pages are refreshing and exciting. It can be interesting to be inside of a thing and outside of it at the same time... Misplaced Pages is sort of like a blog on steroids which is under the control of WADA (World Anti-Doping Agency)! Lmcelhiney 18:26, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

Elsie Ivancich Dunin

For your collection :) -- _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus | talk}  23:29, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

Configurable modularity

I think I've wikified and categorized correctly - so I have removed tags, but added a stub. Hope this is correct. Could you take a look? Thx. Jpaulm 02:23, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

You're right - if it hasn't caught on, maybe we should pull it. It seems a useful concept, but I can describe it inline in my article, and we can leave it at that... Jpaulm 13:49, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for your help creating a fair use rationale for Image:pilot2backgammon.jpg on Thematic motifs of Lost.--Opark 77 08:09, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Redirection of Cylindrachetidae

G'day Elonka. I'm a bit puzzled why you made Cylindrachetidae a redirect rather than leave it as a "definition" page (stub).

As I said in my creation note, "Create page so people don't get confused. Redir's won't do here 'cos it would be circular." I had intended to make it a redirect, but since I reference it from the Sandgroper taxobox, surely that would be a circular redirect?

I'm copying this to the Sandgroper Talk page, perhaps you would like to respond to it there, just to keep other people in the picture. Gordon | Talk, 25 September 2006 @12:51 UTC

Thanks for the praise! I've just done a bit more work on the Cylindrachetidae page, have a Captain Cook (take a look) now. Gordon | Talk, 30 September 2006 @01:39 UTC

Lost mediation

I just wanted to return the thanks. I'm happy with the compromise, and I'm hopeful that we can build strong season articles, possibly even getting some of them to GA status. --Kahlfin 20:11, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Covington & Burling

You added {{db-bio}} to Covington & Burling using AWB. Because CSD A7 does not apply to companies, I have removed the template. You could {{prod}} it if you think WP:CORP applies, but I think an AfD is the best way to go on this article. Agent 86 10:04, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

You added speedy tags to categories when applying uncat tags! Please go back and fix these errors, they are clogging CAT:CSD. Punkmorten 11:28, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Came to think of it, if you wanted to tag them for speedy deletion, it was a bad thing to leave tagging as uncategorized using AWB as edit summary. Punkmorten 11:29, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Did I say categories? Well... sorry, I meant articles.. Punkmorten 21:48, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

reply to question

Well, speedy deletion in this case applies when there's not an assertion of notability. To me, the assertion that it's a song by an apparently popular singer is an assertion of notability. Meeting Misplaced Pages:Notability (songs) or not is more a question for AfD or PROD, speedy deletion is about whether it actually asserts anything that's possibly notable, or not. Traditionally these articles are just turned into redirects to the artist and so on if someone thinks the article is weak, which would appear to be called for in this case. It's a fine point, I admit, but it does serve its purposes (preserving the article history for a future good article, making sure a plausible search term goes to a meaningful target, etc.) --W.marsh 17:00, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Lost mediation

Aha, I'm sorry - I hadn't realised! I've been fixing the articles keeping in with the guidelines of the mediation, removing OR and fancruft from the Trivia sections etc. SergeantBolt (t,c) 19:44, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your note

I'm glad that we're finally through the mediation. And I'm especially happy that I somehow avoided the onslaught of those angry mobs with pitchforks. :) Let's move forward. -- PKtm 21:27, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your message. I know we've had our disagreements in the past (and still have some), but it looks like everything turns out for the best in the end. While we may not always see eye to eye, I enjoy working with people like you who are equally as passionate about making great, encyclopedic articles. Jtrost ( | C | _#) 21:54, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

notability

Hi, saw you tagged contemplative education to dispute its notability. I've tried to address the concern by adding a section on its popularity as well as adding sources. Let me know if this has helped.

Coincidence

You and I both registered for Aikipedia accounts on the same day. Hmm, I found it amusing... -FateSmiled&DestinyLaughed 18:58, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Upon further inspection, we also share an interest in our family history... -FateSmiled&DestinyLaughed 19:30, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Elonka Dunn Page

Just to let you know, I'll try and keep an eye on the Elonka Dunn page. I do think it's strange how your page is being targeted, I noticed that one of the vandals reacted to putting a notability tag on of their created articles by vandalising yours. It wouldn't suprise me if they're all related. Also I've been a bit busy recently but I'll have a look at the Fateh Snr article when I have more time. Englishrose 22:36, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Sigh, so it looks like we've got multiple vandals.Englishrose 19:19, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Re: Borba

Please check histories of articles before nominating them for speedy deletion - this one was a legitimate disambiguation page before it was changed into the advertisement. Zocky | picture popups 03:57, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Apologizing for angry Breanna Conrad summaries

I apologize for my behavior when adding categories/providing an edit summary. I was enraged about the Platte Canyon High School shooting this week and Duane R. Morrison (I settled this by having several Tekken characters beat the crap out of Bryan Fury 20 times in Arcade VS. mode) taking the life of a girl (and then committed suicide), as that is violence towards women, one of my dislikes. I also blamed Vince and Shane McMahon, Jeff Hardy and Bam Margera as well. When you check the page, you should see the changes I made. Thanks, --D.F. "Jun Kazama Master" Williams 04:35, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Elonka Dunin!!!!!

Are you really Elonka Dunin? --Kimberly Ashton 20:12, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

RE: Sources

I removed that from the page due to the fact that somebody had placed that in the wrong episode. It is wrong, and my computer crashed before I could place it in "Further Instructions", which I am about to do. SergeantBolt (t,c) 19:56, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Re CIFAL

Thank-you for your encouragement - you are most kind. I will proceed as suggested.

Maliciousness

They are not related. I nominated the article for deletion for the reasons articulated herein. Then unfamiliar with the rules of Misplaced Pages, I initially deleted the article with comments. I now know there is a quasi-democratic (perhaps excepting the content of this and related pages) process for deletion.

However, I feel the malicious comments made by others about this page and its subject are appalling and disgusting.

In trolling through comments and contributions made over time by Elonka, I might suggest that she edit in a less heavy-handed fashion so as to engender less hostility. Abrupt deletion of content in the face of her own somewhat grandiose family biographies can only engender a sense of imbalance. Nothing however justifies the crude and juvenile actions of the person posting under the 199 IP! DO NOT associate that with me.

Harangus

We're all still learning. You are correctly pointing out that there are two separate issues: 1) Elonka's editing style within the wikipedia universe, and 2) the status of the wikipedia article about Elonka Dunin. The appropriate place for discussing the former is on her user talk page, and the appropriate place for discussing the latter is here. If you do go to her user talk page you'll see quite a lot of spirited give and take (it ain't all pretty). -- Quartermaster 13:05, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Ben MacDui 18:39, 3 October 2006 (UTC)