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Please post new messages to the bottom of my talk page. I will respond at your talk page unless you request otherwise. Thank you. Design copied from User:Duja.

Archives 24 August 2005 – 1 January 2006 1 January 2006 –

Medieval Bosniachood

There are sourced claims of Bosniakhood of people you removed from this article http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=List_of_Bosniaks&diff=71101922&oldid=70751197

you can find sources here http://geocities.com/famous_bosniaks/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bosniak (talk • contribs) 02:17, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Your provacation

Your provacation is tellen to other users your karakter. You are not interest for Kosovo article but to diskriminet the users witch dont know so well english. Thate is all what you whant, this is part of your dirty games. I know thate the Kosovo article is full of serbian propagander but I dont wont to lose my time with you . My target is to make the minro for neutral users. And I have maked You all, cane not presante ONE UN DOCUMENT in witch is tanding "KOSOVO IS PART OF SERBIA". By, by loser— Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.178.105.244 (talk • contribs) 23:09, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

The rest of Kosovo article is mytologie beacose the head of the article is starting with mytologie UN dont accept thate Kosovo is part of Serbia. I dont know why, I dont to know only one think I know the UN members have forgetit this name Serbia.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.178.105.244 (talk • contribs) 23:13, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

I have no idea how am I provoking you. No, I am not particularely interested in the Kosovo article - and I share discrimination for no one. I don't play dirty games. The Kosovo article is not full of Serbian propaganda - everyone has agreed to that version. I am neutral, you can talk to me about anythin', mate. I can't present one UN document saying "Kosovo is part of Serbia", just like I can't find a single UN document saying "Vojvodina is part of Serbia". What makes me a loser? What do you percisely mean by "mythology"? UN members haven't forgotten it - Kosovo is officially a part of independent Serbia. --PaxEquilibrium 23:21, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

HRE

You have changet your user name to complicet thinks like Serbia in Balkan or what is your target???— Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.178.105.244 (talk • contribs) 23:15, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Serbia really did complicate things in the Balkans a lot, didn't it? :) --PaxEquilibrium 23:22, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

People trying to speak English

Nevertheless, Join my project: WikiProject Bosnia and Herzegovina. Pozdrav, Kseferovic 03:04, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Name Change

Why? I liked the old one. It suited you. Davu.leon 13:04, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

He can't change it back, even if he tried. Someone else took his username and I guess is also Montenegrin because he is editing Montenegro-related articles. Crna Gora 18:00, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

In a good way. It was just a little confusing seeing someone else talking in the same articulate and reasoned idiom, expounding the same views, until I realised what had happened. Davu.leon 09:06, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

HRE active again

What the... OK, what's happening here? Are you editing Misplaced Pages as HolyRomanEmperor? Did you register the acc or somebody else did? --Dijxtra 19:57, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Well, it's no matter to you, but to people who don't know that you changed usernames it does matter since they'll think it's you. I'm blocking the guy ASAP. --Dijxtra 20:35, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

It's not a polity, it's just that you claimed to been a target of impersonation before, and you don't know who edits under your old username. It could well be the same person which took your identity last time, don't you think? I think we're better off by blocking in this case. --Dijxtra 20:47, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Odgovor

Pa znam da albanski korisnici optužuju Krisa da je Srbin, a još kad sam video tu reč, pomislio sam da su u pravu. :)) Što se Banata tiče, u vreme Turaka Srbi su bili najbrojniji narod u Banatu, s tim da su Srbi kompaktno naseljavali zapadni Banat, Rumuni istočni, dok je srednji Banat (sa Temišvarom) imao mešano srpsko-rumunsko stanovništvo, ali su Srbi preovlađivali. E sad otkud srednji Banat većinski Rumunski? Rumuni su se malo širili seobom, malo se mešali sa Srbima, pa se deo Srba porumunio, pored toga se i mnogo Nemaca naselilo u srednji Banat, pa su ih Rumuni posle drugog svetskog rata proterali, pa se naselilo onda tu još Rumuna, itd... PANONIAN (talk) 21:21, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Answer about my statement

Hello my friend! Please don't categorise the question of Trianon as an ancient historical event. I don't want to restore the border of Greater-Hungary. It will be unfair and wronger than the current borders. But the current borders are also bad and unfair. I live in Senta. Watch out for its demographics, please. As you can see mre then 80% of the inhabitants are Hungarian, and the remaining 20% is not only Serb. The situation is very similar in Kanjiža, Ada, Bačka Topola etc. We don't need to speak in Serbian because in most of the shops the trader knows to speak on the majority language. The other problem is the rising of the Serb extreme nationalism. Most of the settlers who have come from Republika Srpska, Slavonia causing problems because of the wars they have anti-"minority" sentiments and use violence against Hungarians. After the seccession of Montengro their number is growing and after the future independence of Kosovo there will much more chauvinist inhabitants. Just think about it. They escape from Kosovo just because they can't stand the Montenegrin an Albanian authoroties. This is my "short" answer about my point of view. If you want to know mre about it we should talk. I've always enjoyed to speak with someone who has moderate political views. Hey I am an idealist to! :) And also a war-efugee. What kind of idealism do you support? HunTheGoaT 21:27, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
Oh sorry!:( My English is still not good enough. I've written that I am a war refugee, but I had thought that means to oppose wars. Sorry I'm was stupid. No I'm not a war refugee. Can I speak Hungarian everywhere in Vojvodina? Maybe in fairy tales. In the reality there is always some Serbs who want to hit me when he hears that I am speaking in Hungarian. The second problem is that I and many of my friends cannot speak Serbian well. Because the mode of Serbian language's education is very bad. On Serbian language lessons we learn more about the Serbian history than about the language itself. And the lections are mostly in somekind of ancient slavic language. It's not a joke. We sometimes read stories in pre-Vuk Karadžić Serbian language or in Macedonian. That's not very usefull. The education mode should be changed. Now I know the meaning of word war refugee and I became sad when I read it in the dictionary:( So you may have bad things in your memory when someone is talking about the Yugoslav wars. Why have you become a war refugee?HunTheGoaT 22:14, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

I can't understand these people. Why they use there national sentiments to discriminate other. I like to be Magyar as you can see on my userpage. I like our nations literature the Hungarian poems are the worlds more rythmic ones. And Hungarian is the language of vowel harmony as linguists say. My mothertoungh is one of the beutyful langueges in the world. I love my etnicity but this is not a reason to hate others. We shouldn't use our nationality to discriminate other cultures. In my opinio nall cultures are nice in their own way. So I am against cultural globalisation but I support the idea of coproductive nations. Can I ask where do you live now?HunTheGoaT 17:55, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Both of us live in the world. But in which city, town of village where you have a house or a flat. Where is the computer that you make your articles. With that computer you can connect with the whole world. But WHERE is it? This is just a simple friendly question that the people usually ask from each other. OK if you don't want to answer it that is your problem.

HunTheGoaT 18:35, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
Yes of course you've answered it. I'm just a student at the moment so unfortunatly the school takes all my time and I've got no time for writing a lot of article but if I write one watch out for that please. I am intrested in your oppinion about them because you looks like a kind and a calm person whose statements are real valuable.HunTheGoaT 19:09, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Montenegro

I'm assuming you are the same guy I was having a debate about Montenegran identity? Here is my response:

Wait, wait, wait... Please re-read the list that I gave you - and tell me, would it be wrong to Consider Montenegrins Croats (or at least by origin). Just tell me that (and as I recall you supported 1's words of all Bosnian are ethnic Croats).

As I recall, I merely pointed to the observation that such a claim was probably a debased one & that in place of the word "all", the author meant "most". In the case of the notion that "most Bosnians were ethnic Croat", I would not find it a radical thing to say that. Having said that, I reiterate that such debates are usually devoid of academic value and subject to political manipulations. I would also consider such claims personally as having ambiguous meaning, what does it mean for a whole people to be ethnic <insert nationality here>, beyond a sense of cultural kinship?

Serb state control over the territory or control by a Serbian elite? What on earth are you talking about? The greater part of Montenegro speaks the root Serbian language - East Herzegovinian dialect, spoken also in Republika Srpska and West Serbia (and Dubrovnik). Dubrovnik, Herzegovina and parts of Dalmatia speak the same Croatian dialect. I have roots from Eastern Herzegovina and plenty of family in Dubrovnik (which incidently has alot of Croats from Herzegovina). Trust me on this one.

What I mean by state control is that throughout history smaller cultures/nations can seem non-existent, subsumed by a larger neighbour. Such is the case with the Macedonians and Slovenians, Bosnjiaks and Montenegrans.

The smaller part speaks an indiginous Kosovar Zetan dialect of the Serbo-Croat. Historicly, the Serbian language has been official in the constitution of 1910; and all Montenegrin works were written strictly in that language. the existence of similar or common language does not preclude separate identity as is the case with the Fins & Swedes for example. There's a problem here - Finnish is a lot more different than Swedish - and Finns don't call their language "Swedish language", but "Finnish" instead.

Again, under foreign state control, the dominant powers language would be imposed and considering the similarity of the languages, the process would be seemless. Just as you claimed that the independence movement has strong support from todays govt institutions, so too the unitarists campaign during WW1, and the first Jugoslavia would have had a free hand to foster assimilation into the Serbian identity.

There isn't a strong Montenegrin nationality today - with every census, more and more montenegrins opt Serbian nationality instead of Montenegrin and more and more montenegrins opt the Montenegrin language and the Montenegrin Orthodox Church, rather than the Serbian language or the Serbian Orthodox Church. The only strong Montenegrin national identity exists within the current nationalistic regime and the minority of the so-called "docleano-montenegrins", which belong to a radical group that's pro-Croat orientated, support Greater Croatian nationalist ideology, xenophoby and found quasi-historical research centers such as the "Doclean Academy of Sciences and Arts". Extremists don't deserve mention.

Yet, there is a strong enough Montenegran nationality for them to reclaim their independence in 2006 and is certainly not a case of doing it solely for economic reasons. Down near Cetinje, after the result was known, a minority of Montenegran nationalist were singing derogatory songs about Serbs and equating them to Chetniks. The WW2 attrocities from the war between Montengran Nationalists and Greater Serb Chetniks are still remembered by some.

To equate the Montenegran Independence movement as some orphan of Croat nationalism (through the history of Red Croatia) goes counter to some pertinent facts. For starters, the Montenegrans had independence pre-Jugoslavia Mk1. 40% odd declare Montenegran ethnicity at the last census. Montenegro has declared independence in 2006.

In WWII - what on earth are you talking about? The so-called "Kingdom of Montenegro" was ruled by a fascist Italian Axis puppet-regime that based itself upon the extermination of Jews, Romas and the Serbian element in Montenegro.

So was the Serbia under Milan Nedic and NDH under Ante Pavelic. Does that invalidate the notions of Serb and Croat nationalities or states?

Anyone declaring openly a Serb - was dispatched to Jasenovac, Kotor or elsewhere. In 1941 the people of Montenegro raised a Chetnik rebellion, which almost managed to overthrough the Governor's regime. With the help of the Ustasha armed forces (not many montenegrins decided to collaborate and fight), Governor Sekula Drljevic either slaughtered the Chetniks or fought-off the minority to the Royal Independent State of Croatia and/or to the Kingdom of Serbia. His next move was to eradicate anyone whatsoever related to the Chetniks and/or anything Serbian, when his Ustasha, Italian and other collaborationist corps ethnicly cleansed over 10% of Montenegro's population.

Are you are aware that disparate chetnik units collaborated with either Ustasha, German Nazis or Italian Fascists? So much so that the allies stop sending them aid. The Montenegran Chetniks were merely carrying out the plan to create Greater Serbia and to that end collaborated with fascists. Here's a link on the nature of such collaboration; http://www.vojska.net/eng/world-war-2/montenegro/chetniks/

Point is that a fascist government does not invalidate a national identity.

The fascistoid regime retreated to Zagreb, where it founded a Government in Exile after the Axis forces introduced martial control and were subsequently expelled by the Partisans; drafting there a constitution and re-writing the Montenegrin national anthem so that it could evade mentioning anything Serbian. In 1945, the People's Assembly of Montenegro declared In Montenegro live only the purest of Serbs, however, Tito responded by Montenegrins are Serbs, different from other Serbs, and a dark period of history came until it was formalized in 1946 that all Montenegrins, no matter of origin accept the Montenegrin nationality - naturally, only Serbs accepted this on large scale. It is not until 1974 that the Serbian element in Montenegro was eradicated, when the Communists mass-burned several Churches, including the personal endowment of Njegos himself.

It is a flaw to denote Montenegran Independence as some sort of Fascist invention. The same notion was tried with Croatdom despite it's rich history - hence I take any such notion with skepticism. The 1974 constituion was an attempt to short circuit the ongoing battle between fedaralists and unitarits adn formalise the equality of nations concept which was the foundation of the Partisan movement. Otherwise you would not have a Croatia or Bosnia or Macedonia Or Crnagora for fear of the Greater Serbia politics of the 1st Jugoslavia.

Whilst I concede that there may be some credence to the historical and cultural kinship you bring up, I think the notion of ethnic origin of a whole people is flawed, subject to misinterpretation and goes counter to modern day reality. croatian_quoll 07:41, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Shkodër

Hi Pax, I see you've been having issues at the Shkodër article. Do you need any assistance? --Tekleni 15:49, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

I'll keep an eye on it. Interestingly, the dispute seems to be about languages - if you check the revision histories of Korçë, Sarandë, Himarë, Gjirokastër etc, you'll see quite a bit of edit warring over the names; they seem to consider it Greek irredentist claims to Albania. That's odd considering Albanian nationalists are claiming territory form almost all their neighbors. Also, sorry for changing my username (Special:Log/renameuser) in the middle of the discussion - I followed your example! --Tekleni 18:31, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Arpagjiki

Yes I'm aware that it was a plain removal. But that part of the article had no connection whatsoever with Albanian language, and because of that it deserved to be deleted. Thanks for the welcoming message by the way! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Arpagjiki (talk • contribs) 14:02, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

There was a socalled chechen-albanian-english dictionary, the words that it contained had no meaning with english language. It's obvious that it was wirtten by some retarded guy who maybe thought that he had discovered america :P. These kind of things shouldn't be tolerated here in wikipedia!

Constitution of Croatia

The text in question was changed in 1997 or so. The original 1990 version ran as I quoted, check it here. --Elephantus 04:26, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Hello, I was born in Trebinje but lived there only until the age of 6, then we went to Dubrovnik (Ragusan is my name here!!). Since 1982 I have lived with my wife in England. But my sister tells me it is typical autumn for Herzegovina (she is in Trebinje now). But I am still Balkanite at heart! :) Ragusan 23:17, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Serbs of Mostar

You want to help me out with this? I'd really appreciate it :) --estavisti 01:12, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Re:

I'm from Montenegro. My mom is from Berane while my dad is from Podgorica. Emperor of Europe 15:55, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Unfortunately, no. I'm Muslim. How about you? (the clan thing) Emperor of Europe 16:17, 8 October 2006 (UTC)