User talk:Noahlaws: Difference between revisions

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Revision as of 22:00, 26 November 2006 editJayjg (talk \| contribs)Autopatrolled, Administrators134,922 editsm Reverted edits by 12.64.216.126 (talk) to last version by Irishguy← Previous edit		Revision as of 01:31, 27 November 2006 edit undo12.64.30.254 (talk) To comfort youNext edit →
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	Please let me know if you object my copying your boxes. I am not sure how that works either. ]		Please let me know if you object my copying your boxes. I am not sure how that works either. ]

			:In hope of comforting you. Noahide, I've seen some of your daily battles on Misplaced Pages, and I really feel sorry for what you have to go through (even though you're profoundly anti-Messianic Judaism, my religious beliefs). But I have to recommend to you that you be a little more low-key in your additions to articles, and anytime you insert the Noahide mitzvot you make sure it is pretty relevant, as we have many deletionists on Misplaced Pages (perhaps more so than really necessary, esp. since they like to throw out the baby with the bathwater). Perhaps you should examine some of the following links, in understanding why I believe Messianic Judaism is valid. But I hope to G-d you stay away from the wacko groups: Namely, stay away from "Jews" for Jesus (lying missionaries), and also Messiah "Truth" (lying anti-missionaries) on the other end of the spectrum. And, oh yes, I do believe in the Noahide laws, more their content than their context, but who can deny that this world wouldn't be a far better place if everyone just at least kept the simple, decent laws of Noah.

			Messianic Jewish Websites and Organizations:

			YashaNet: http://yashanet.com/

			Rabbinate Yeshiva: http://www.mjti.org/index.htm

			UMJC: http://www.umjc.net/

			Hashivenu: http://www.hashivenu.org/

			MJ Anti-Prosyletism: http://messianicworship.com/html/messianic.html

			UTOM: http://www.utom.org/index8.htm

			OMJRA: http://www.omjra.org

			Nazarene Kaballah: http://www.nazarenekabbalah.net/index.htm

			T.O.M.J. Beis, Orthodox Messianic Jews: http://www.geocities.com/~rabbi1/beit.html


			Great examples of Messianic Jewish synagogues:

			Melech Yisrael: http://www.cmy.on.ca/index.htm

			Beit Avanim Chaiot: http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/beit_avanim_chaiot/

			Beit Yeshua: http://www.beityeshua.org/first.html

			Beth El: http://www.bethelnyc.org/index.asp

			Simchat Torah: http://joyofthetorah.org/news.php

			Shuvah Yisral: http://www.shuvah.com/

			Avahat Zion http://www.ahavatzion.org/

			Beth Israel (Sephardic rite): http://www.bethisraeltampa.org/


			Historical evidence for a Suffering Messiah in Judaism, and why Yesheyahu (Isaiah) 53 cannot refer to Israel:

			http://www.bethelnyc.org/sufferingmessiah.asp

			http://bethsar.com/10_Reasons.htm

			Shlom. ] 21:21, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Revision as of 01:31, 27 November 2006

USER PAGE: Noahlaws

Welcome!

Hello, Noahlaws, and welcome to Misplaced Pages! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Misplaced Pages:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Again, welcome! Jon513 19:53, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

Regarding edits to God

I think you may want to look at Misplaced Pages's neutral point of view policy. JoshuaZ 20:18, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

Regarding recent edits

As per above I agree whole heartedly. Please do not wikilink noahide laws all over wikipedia. For instance, the statement "developed from noahide laws", does not belong every place the word "Judaism" comes up in a wiki article. If you continue this it will be evident that for some reason you are spamming this wikilink.PelleSmith 20:27, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

Furthermore, it isn't historically clear if all of these things developed from the Noachide laws. Many scholars would argue that that is a late invention and so edits like what you did to the article on Abrahamic religions are at best non-neutral. JoshuaZ 20:31, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

There is missing information, alernative option should be included to clarify things from a Jewish perspective. In some of the pages, I found it insulting for the Jew to be excluded from Torah. Who best to answer question about it than a Jew? For a non-Jew to article about Jewish values is awkward and is falsifying information.

Please stop

Please stop adding comments about the Noachide laws to so many pages. Your edits are running seriously afoul of Misplaced Pages's neutral point of view policy. JoshuaZ 21:09, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

YOUR FINAL WARNING

This is your only warning; if you vandalize Misplaced Pages again, you may be blocked from editing without further notice. --Elar a girl 00:49, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Regarding edits made during November 22 2006 (UTC) to Proselyte

This is your last warning.
The next time you vandalize a page, you will be blocked from editing Misplaced Pages. Elar a girl 00:53, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Blocked

You are temporarily blocked. You can still edit this talk page, so please respond here to the complaints made by other editors about your addition of links in violation of the NPOV policy. If you do not make a good faith attempt to compromise and collaborate with other editors, you'll be blocked indefinitely. Chick Bowen 01:01, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

By the way, there is A LOT of false information in many of the pages

WHAT? So , in other words, if I'm not a Jew, I can't write about Jewish values or in Jewish articles? --Elar a girl 01:21, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

I am not sure how to use this interface so I am doing this way.

What I meant was a QUALIFIED person should be able to best write about Judaism and Jewish Values. Someone who lives by those values, like Orthodox Jews and Orthodox Rabbis. As an example, in the Christianity section the Tanakh, Judaism, etc is brought up to contribute their story. I feel that it is a dirty thing to do. To take possession of what does not belong in Christianity to substituate it. It is using Jewish values to prop Christianity.

By the way, Messianic Judaism IS NOT Judaism. It is part of the Missionary activities done to unkowing Jews who are not educated enough. They are taking Judaism bits and pieces and converting to their needs to accept their beliefs. It is highly objected within Judaism.

Also in the page of Christianity, how can it be said that it is a Monotheisitic religion?

Monotheism is believing in one God, which Christianity does. As for the qualified person thing, I take it you believe that only those whose beliefs are 100% in accord with your own would be qualified? IrishGuy 02:15, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Monotheism is belief in ONE G-d. G-d is not human and it is not reincarnated. Messiah is a man who we all wait. It is someone who is under G-d. He will be married and have children.

Why are my suggetions being overided?

In Anusim as well? Anusim are descendents of Jews. There suggestion of organizations to help them are being taken away. Shavei Israel should be there as well as Esratlanousim.org and the option of them being Noahides. Noahides are very much into Judaism and acceptable.

G-d can be describe (for a better description) as energy all over us and in us. The intelect, the intelligence, the feelings all eminate from G-d. It is life giving. And events talks to us because He wishes us to know. He is all powerful, ominiputent.

That's my point right there. Since you don't personally believe in the Trinity, that means that Christianity must not possibly be monotheistic. Your personal opinions don't supercede those of others...or, frankly, the Dogma of other faiths. Constantly linking to a Jewish article about Jewish beliefs about Gentiles is, honestly, doing some serious POV pushing missionary work. Misplaced Pages isn't a venue for you to push your own beliefs onto others. IrishGuy 02:45, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Noahlaws, I think you may be missing the point of all of this. At Misplaced Pages, our goal is not to spread God's truth; it's merely to report what other verifiable, reliable sources present as truth. Seriously--that's all we do. This is an encyclopedia; it's not meant to pass judgement on Jews, Christians, Messianists, or anyone else. It just says what other people think. Please read our neutral point of view policy, which is the best summation of what this site is for. Chick Bowen 02:48, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Even if these verifialble sources have been taken from original Judaism and distorted and being used against Jews?

We use sources from many different viewpoints, so that we have a balance. Some of those may be hostile to Jews, yes, but these will be placed in a context so that it's clear where the information is coming from. But it's not our job to represent Judaism from a Jewish point of view; it's our job to represent it from a neutral point of view. Chick Bowen 03:21, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Noahlaws, you have been blocked because of your disruptive behaviour (such as linkspamming) and not for your strong views on these issues. In this regard I second what Chick wrote above.

As for the Tanakh being taken away - no one is doing that. Jews (meaning adherents of Rabbinical Judaism) follow the Tanakh (and the Talmud) and no on is hindering them. But, as a Christian, I must take exception to the claim that we have somehow stolen the Tanakh or Old Testament. Ever since Christianity existed, even before the New Testament came into being, these books have been regarded as Sacred Scripture and it is not for you to decide that we can't use them (that would indeed be taking it away). You see, Christians (and that means Gentiles and Jews) believe that Jesus is the Messiah promised in Scripture - Rabbinical Judaism does reject that ... and these are the two groups that survived from the very many Jewish religious groups in the 1st century. We could argue about this all day but it is not for WP to decide this issue.

You are complaining about falsifying information, but I'd like you to get informed about what Christianity actually teaches (not "reincarnation") before you give your judgement. And the same goes for Judaism ... the idea that God is an energy is not particularly Jewish.

Str1977 11:04, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

The Tanach is JEWISH and if you follow as the JEWISH History book, you will see that things have been taken from Jews to prop up whatever belief. There you go telling a Jew, what a Jew is and isn't. JEWS DO NOT BELIEVE in Jesus. You have the wrong information. Please contact Jews for Judaism and ask questions. I feel I am being blocked because someone does not want the truth to be exposed and for the truth to be transposed by their beliefs. I feel that I am being missionized at this very moment.

Here is a job description for the Messiah - simplified so people could understand better. http://www.virtualyeshiva.com/counter/wanted.swf

Also do not down play Rabbis. They are very much a part of Judaism. People can be for Hashem/G-d or not.

Judaism does contain Reincarnation. Moses was a reincarnation of Abel. Yitro was a part reincarnation of Cain who slew Abel. They corrected part of that mistake at that time. Also Abraham and Sara corrected part of Adam and Eve's mistake. It is obvious that you are too into the dogma to understand that there is a spiritual side to Judaism within the traditional Judaism that includes Rabbinical. It is the choice that was given. Abiding by the laws is the road to correcting mistakes as well and leads to spirituality in a high level. As for my description it is my description, for a better way of explaining G-d. If we abide by His rule, all is fine. If we transgress, war, diseases, disasters appear. I, for one, do not want nuclear wars.

In Noah's Time, in the JEWISH bible, when men did not follow the laws, Hashem sent the flood. He regave the 6 Laws that Adam and Eve were given and added the 7th since men started to eat meat. Again, when we follow Hashem's path, all is fine; when we do not, when we bend the rules, we create polution within the spiritual realm and bring things back to earth and into ourselves.

We all are in this world together. Hashem wants us to cohabit. It is important for all humanity to abide by the laws and not make up dogmas and follow them. We all came from the same source, Adam. We are part of that soul. All souls came originally from Adam whose soul was broken into smaller pieces after his sin (allusion that he brought death into the world). Please don't say what is Jewish or not to a practicing TRADITIONAL Jew.

Hashem gave to the Jews the job to be priests to the world and people seem to want to steal that job from them. In the JEWISH bible, it is said that non-Jews will grab a Jew and say teach us. Also it is said, who curses a Jew, he will be cursed. The Children of Israel are the original. Do not try to replace them with dogmas.

So you're just spreading the word? Other than a basic relationship to Abrahamic religions, is there a method to or program for the insertion of the wikilink Noahide laws? Are you trying to get people to notice this link or to add constructively to the entries you kept adding it to?PelleSmith 15:43, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

NL, there you go telling everyone what is Jewish and what not (demonstrating that you haven't read my posting carefully, as I did not claim many of the things you attribute to me) all the while proposing doctrines foreign to the Jewish religion, such as reincartion, God as an energy. All that while ignoring that Christianity spread from the Jewish religion as well. You say Jews don't believe in Jesus (by which I guess you mean "in his being the Messiah") - that is true if by Jew you mean an adherent to the Rabbinical-Talmudic Jewish religion (a.k.a. Orthodox Judaism) and its modern offspring - however, there have always been Jews, sons and daughters of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob believing to have found the Messiah in Jesus, from the Apostle down to the present day (e.g. Edith Stein). We can and must disagree which of the two is right in the contentious issues, but you are arrogantly dismissing anything not adhering to your narrow interpretation all the while not adhering to orthodox Judaism yourself. Finally, you loudly denounce dogmata while you are proclaiming dogmata yourself. Str1977 17:18, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

I was inserting missing information which it was taken away, Why was that????

Str, is this an inquisition? There are those not educated in Torah who deviate and are used by others because their are the offspring of Jacob. How do you know what I say is not true? How do you know, clearly you are not a Jew and are into your dogma.

This no inquisition and you can believe whatever you like. But don't lecture others if you have trouble with the Jewish religion yourself. And no, I am not a Jew. Discussion ended. No need to reply as I won't be reading it. Str1977 18:11, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

_________________________________________________________________________________________

Here are miracles happening: Bnai Menashe/Children of Menashe/Tribe of Menashe return to the people of Israel. http://www.jerusalemonline.com - It will soon be changed to Wed news.

Shavei Israel belongs with the Anusim as I previously stated. Also http://saudades.org -> Portuguese descendents from the the inquisition.

Much damage has been done to Jews over dogmas. These descendants have the right to know they can reconnect to their roots. Also Noahide Laws is one of the paths for them as a choice.

Here is an informative link acceptable in Judaism about the Noahide laws http://moshiach.com/action

Also; I had added http://www.academyofshem.com to that page and it was taken out.

And...

Everything you post has nothing to do with articles outside of Judiasm.

I suppose if you believe Islam is a false religion according to Judaism you will try to get it deleted? --Elar a girl 19:10, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Please do not put your thinking into mine. I added missing information. Jewish facts were being used. When doing so, give fairness and really give, not just take. Specially when the taking was without permission.

In regards to Islam, see this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wPglHZQf-0

More...

For more information, see this blog's link section - Right side of the page. http://7lawsofnoah.tblog.com

A further attempt to explain

Many of the articles you have added mentions of the Noachide laws to are only peripherally connected at best. You really need to read Misplaced Pages's neutral point of view policy. JoshuaZ 20:32, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Further explanation

There were pages there that had counter section. When I did the same, it was erased. 98% of my contributions were erased. It is not fair, specially when it was directly related to the subject. To insert a link to inform people is beeing put as if I am being partial. Many pages SHOULD have Noahide Laws as further links to investigate.

Noahlaws

Linkspam

Please stop adding inappropriate external links to Misplaced Pages. It is considered spamming, and Misplaced Pages is not a vehicle for advertising. Thanks. -- Avi 18:06, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

I am not sure what you are refering to. I am not advertising.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Noahlaws (talk • contribs) 13:46, November 23, 2006 (UTC)

Per WP:EL one should not add extra, unnecessary, links to articles, even if you are not advertising. Secondly, you are in danger of violating WP:3RR on Messianic Judaism. Please read the policies carefully to help you become a more productive editor here. -- Avi 18:59, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

This is your last warning. The next time you insert a spam link, you will be blocked from editing Misplaced Pages. Persistent spammers may have their websites blacklisted from Misplaced Pages. IrishGuy 20:12, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Why do you make me into a spammer? I am NOT a spammer! I feel that I am being made to shut up! This is highly not fair.

And when I ask, no one responds and am given warnings!

Noahlaws

This entire talk page has explained everything...you simply wait for your block to expire and start doing it again. Please stop. As for your external links, as explained, they don't meet WP:EL. Blogs and mailing lists violate the guidelines for external links. IrishGuy 21:43, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

OBJECTION

Why are my objections being deleted?

I feel that I am being made to shut up and accept everything and all the contributions been taken away from me. It is a form of stealing.

Nobody is "stealing" anything from you. You simply continue to willfully violate the 3 revert rule, the guidelines of external links, as well as your completely non-neutral POV pushing. All of these guidelines have been explained to you numerous time by numerous editors...and yet you continue to disrupt. As long as you willfully violate these guidelines, your edits will be reverted. IrishGuy 23:19, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

per your question

The top of my user page make it appear to someone visiting the they have new mail, but in fact is just a link to Practical Joke. I hope you weren't exceptionally inconvenienced. As to why your edits are being revert I strongly recommend that you read Misplaced Pages:External links which details what are and are not appropriate external links in an article. In a nutshell only exceptionally high quality and relevant links are to be added. For example, Noahide links have little to do with Messianic Judaism. Links should provide more information for that subject, not information on a (questionably) related subject. Also you additions to Anusim implies that you do not understand the subject matter as Noahide Laws are neither "Laws that could be applied to Anusim" or an "Alternative choice for Anusim", the two subject have almost nothing to do with one another. I you have any other question feel free to ask me on my talk page. Jon513 15:09, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

7LawsOfNoah link as a voice for Jews and Noachides and it is my group. I also inserted a link to a Noachide webpage as a response http://academyofshem.com since the book very much deal with the objection ( http://academyofshem.com/Products.html )

Please let me know if you object my copying your boxes. I am not sure how that works either. Noahlaws

In hope of comforting you. Noahide, I've seen some of your daily battles on Misplaced Pages, and I really feel sorry for what you have to go through (even though you're profoundly anti-Messianic Judaism, my religious beliefs). But I have to recommend to you that you be a little more low-key in your additions to articles, and anytime you insert the Noahide mitzvot you make sure it is pretty relevant, as we have many deletionists on Misplaced Pages (perhaps more so than really necessary, esp. since they like to throw out the baby with the bathwater). Perhaps you should examine some of the following links, in understanding why I believe Messianic Judaism is valid. But I hope to G-d you stay away from the wacko groups: Namely, stay away from "Jews" for Jesus (lying missionaries), and also Messiah "Truth" (lying anti-missionaries) on the other end of the spectrum. And, oh yes, I do believe in the Noahide laws, more their content than their context, but who can deny that this world wouldn't be a far better place if everyone just at least kept the simple, decent laws of Noah.

Messianic Jewish Websites and Organizations:

YashaNet: http://yashanet.com/

Rabbinate Yeshiva: http://www.mjti.org/index.htm

UMJC: http://www.umjc.net/

Hashivenu: http://www.hashivenu.org/

MJ Anti-Prosyletism: http://messianicworship.com/html/messianic.html

UTOM: http://www.utom.org/index8.htm

OMJRA: http://www.omjra.org

Nazarene Kaballah: http://www.nazarenekabbalah.net/index.htm

T.O.M.J. Beis, Orthodox Messianic Jews: http://www.geocities.com/~rabbi1/beit.html

Great examples of Messianic Jewish synagogues:

Melech Yisrael: http://www.cmy.on.ca/index.htm