Misplaced Pages

This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Ruadh (talk | contribs) at 10:59, 5 March 2007. The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Hello,

It seems we might have gotten off a bad start. Like I said, Misplaced Pages is built on compromise, and I believe the compromise I offered in economics of fascism was more than reasonable. None of your citations were removed. We can either talk about it and reach a decision that we are both satisfied with, or we can keep reverting forever. It's your call... Ruadh 15:14, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

You should notice that the only thing I removed was your Hitler quote, and the only reason for that was because it could easily be misunderstood when read out of context. Hitler also made numerous statements in support of private property and private enterprise, especially farmers and small businesses. As you point out on your user page, he advocated a "third way" approach. The quote may give the wrong impression that he sided with state socialism, or Marxism, or something like communism, when in fact he was strongly opposed to all those things (and any equality-based ideology in general). Ruadh 15:26, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

That's not all you removed. You removed the demands on the NAZI program as well. I disagree that the Hitler quote can be misunderstood out of context. He advocated a socialist system where the state directs private enterprise to work for the good of the people instead of being selfish. Laissez-faire capitalism was the enemy and was strangling the population. State control over the means of production is socialism. If anything could be taken out of context it's the Mussolini quote saying that there would be a laissez-faire system. It was not a laissez-faire system except in the begining because Mussolini had to compromise to gain more power. Once he gained more power, he did the right thing and took control over the economy.

Very well then, I will look for other Hitler quotes that we could add in order to clarify his position. "Socialism" is a buzzword that has been used by everyone to mean anything. I'd much rather give a slightly longer but more accurate description, such as "Hitler advocated a private enterprise economy directed by the state to serve the national interest". Remember also that, although Hitler did have economic views, he did not consider them particularly important. Same goes for Mussolini. They were willing to accept any economic arrangement that promoted the good of the nation, as they saw it.

Also, please stop thinking that you could somehow make me go away just be reverting the page over and over again. I am not going away, and I think the compromise I offered is more than reasonable. I'm afraid you will just have to learn to work together with me. Ruadh 08:41, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

It is very relavant that that quote by in the article. Hitler was anti-laissez-faire. It was a socialist economy. I understand that socialism is a somewhat vague term but that doesn't matter. It was called "national socialism" afterall. The means of production were controlled by the people with the Fuhrer as their representative. Billy Ego 04:12, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

Ok, fine. I've decided to adopt your policy that nothing should be removed from the article if it has a citation. I have shortened the quote a bit, however, because I believe long quotes disrupt the flow of an article. I also found a quote of my own which I believe clarifies Hitler's views:

"I absolutely insist on protecting private property. It is natural and salutary that the individual should be inspired by the wish to devote a part of his income from his work to building up and expanding a family estate. Suppose the estate consists of a factory. I regard it as axiomatic that this factory will be better run by one of the members of the family than it would be by a State functionary... In this sense, we must encourage private initiative."

Notice that I only added a shortened version of this quote into the article. That seemed like the fair thing to do, since I also shortened your quote. I think putting two long quotes side by side would be ugly. Ruadh 10:58, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Fascist Wikipedians

A tag has been placed on Category:Fascist Wikipedians, requesting that it be speedily deleted from Misplaced Pages. This has been done because the article is a repost of material that was previously deleted following a deletion debate, such as articles for deletion. If you can indicate how Category:Fascist Wikipedians is different from the previously posted material, or if you can indicate why this article should not be deleted, I advise you to place the template {{hangon}} underneath the other template on the article, and also put a note on ] saying why this article should stay. An admin should check for such edits before deleting the article. Feel free to leave a note on my talk page if you have any questions about this. Please read our criteria for speedy deletion, particularly item 4 under General criteria. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself. We welcome your help in trying to improve Misplaced Pages, and we ask you to follow these instructions. Happy Editing by Snowolf_CON on 09:37, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

Again you deleted it without giving me a change to vote or respond. And what are you talking about "material"? It's not the posting of "material." It is the creation of a category. I'm going to create it again. "Article"? What article are you talking about. It isn't an article. What you are saying or whatever rule you're talking about can't apply. Billy Ego 02:32, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Please see http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:User_categories_for_discussion/Archive/September_2006#Category:Fascist_Wikipedians for previous discussion on this topic. -- The Anome 09:16, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

1. A private statement made by Hitler on March 24, 1942. Cited in "Hitler's Secret Conversations." Translated by Norman Cameron and R.H. Stevens. Farrar, Straus and Young, Inc. 1953. p. 294