Talk:Superman - Misplaced Pages

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December 15, 2003	Featured article candidate	Promoted
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Superman Copyright

Hi!

Wanted to chat a bit more about that copyright. United States works enter copyright every year on January 1, and they do not enter on a rolling basis through the year. You're right that they expire on January 1 and not on December 31.

In 2023, works from 1927 entered the public domain following a full 95 years worth of time since that year. Since Superman was first introduced in a work published in 1938, he will have to wait a full 95 years after 1938 to become public domain in the United States. Using the difference of 96 between 1927 and 2023, this means that Superman would enter the public domain in 2034 in the United States. I didn't want to just revert your edit, and I appreciate abiding by the citation.

With all that said, what are your thoughts on changing the copyright date to January 1, 2034 with a note for American copyright? MonkeyBBGB (talk) 18:44, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

@MonkeyBBGB: Cite me the law which says that all copyrights start and end on January 1. I researched copyright law quite carefully when I wrote this article. Also, in The Law for Comic Creators by Joe Sergi, he says that the copyright for Superman will expire in 2033. He's lawyer, so he should know what he's talking about. Kurzon (talk) 19:12, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

Section § 304 of and Section § 305 of U.S. Code Title 17 lay out the terms for works from before 1978. Section § 304 states that "Any copyright, the first term of which is subsisting on January 1, 1978, shall endure for 28 years from the date it was originally secured." This would be the initial 28 year term that Superman's original comic from 1938 had. Following its renewal in 1966, it would then qualify for a 28 year term renewal under copyright law at the time. However, under the revised § 304 this would be 75 years under 1976's law and 95 years under the further revised 1998 law. This manifests as "the copyright shall endure for a renewed and extended further term of 67 years". Further, "Any copyright still in its renewal term at the time that the Sonny Bono Copyright Term Extension Act becomes effective shall have a copyright term of 95 years from the date copyright was originally secured."

Add to this that Section § 305 states that "All terms of copyright provided by sections 302 through 304 run to the end of the calendar year in which they would otherwise expire." 95 years from 1938 is 2033, and the comic was published in April, 1938. With that addition, Superman would be covered for the full duration of 95 years and then the rest of the calendar year from 1938. This effectively means that Superman's copyright expires at 11:59 and 59 seconds PM on December 31, 2033, or January 1, 2034.

So I guess 2033 is technically correct in the slimmest terms, but effectively Superman will become public domain in 2034. MonkeyBBGB (talk) 19:44, 5 June 2023 (UTC)

Fictional character biography Missing

How come this article doesn't have a Fictional character biography like Batman or Wonder Woman or many other comic book characters?

https://en.wikipedia.org/Batman#Fictional_character_biography

https://en.wikipedia.org/Wonder_Woman#Fictional_character_biography 173.66.8.230 (talk) 19:49, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

To avoid fancruft. It used to have one but I deleted it. Kurzon (talk) 20:29, 8 June 2023 (UTC)

Why isn't Martha listed as a parent 2607:FB91:168A:632C:7DA0:FA33:F8C7:D4F5 (talk) 18:12, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

Frome the lede: He was found and adopted by farmers Jonathan and Martha Kent, who named him Clark Kent. DonQuixote (talk) 19:35, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 29 June 2023

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add missing word "to" by changing "and he decided use his powers to fight crime" to "and he decided to use his powers to fight crime" HendrikSt (talk) 19:04, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

Already done Cannolis (talk) 20:38, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

Quickrunfast

@Quickrunfast: Superman wasn't much inspired by Jewish mythology. I read every interview with Siegel and Shuster I could find and they never went into Jewish mythology, and they were quite open about their creative process. Also, the persecution of Jews in Germany didn't inspire any specific aspect of Superman. Kurzon (talk) 14:30, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

Respectfully, there's been quite a few books that were dedicated to the topic and the quote that I cite is real and says just that. The updated also removed the myth of Superman as Ubermensch (since that was lex Luther). Quickrunfast (talk) 22:09, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

Also, sometimes people forget that the "Old Testament" is Jewish — so there's the Moses story origin myth, Samson strength, "kal-el," and the later Jewish myth of Golem. Quickrunfast (talk) 02:13, 4 July 2023 (UTC)

@Quickrunfast: When I researched for this article a few years ago, I was very interested in this very topic and looked hard for hard evidence and didn't find any. All I could find to support it was speculative stuff by writers who were arguing from circumstantial evidence. Simcha Weinstein was one of these. He's a rabbi and I suspect he was trying to make Judaism look cool by arguing Superman is Jewish. He pointed out circumstantial things such as the similarities with the Moses myth and the name Kal-El possibly being Hebrew. But I wanted hard evidence, namely something Siegel or Shuster said in an interview, and I didn't find any. What's more, Siegel and Shuster weren't practicing Jews. They both married Christian women. When I emailed Simcha Weinstein for comment, he just brushed me off, he didn't want to argue with me.

Simply citing a book is not enough to validate a claim. You can find a citation to support anything if you're not discerning. In fact, I found citation to refute the Judaism connection: in Les Daniels' 1998 book, he wrote:

"There are parallel stories in many cultures, but what is significant is that Siegel, working in the generally patronized medium of the comics, had created a secular American messiah. Nothing of the kind was consciously on his mind, apparently: his explanation for dropping Superman down from the sky was that "it just happened that way."And Shuster echoed him: "We just thought it was a good idea."

See what I mean? Kurzon (talk) 12:14, 4 July 2023 (UTC)

Again, I did cite an article that contained a quote from one of the *creators of Superman*.

Suspecting that one author is trying to make look "Jews look cool" is unsupported and (essentially) an ad hominem attack based on the authors identity. Even if we suppose you are true, it still does not invalidate what the creators have said — surely they are the authority on the subject of their creation, right.

If you have have evidence to the contrary, please feel free to add. Quickrunfast (talk) 14:59, 24 August 2023 (UTC)

Missing tv appearances

My Adventures with Superman - 2023 HBO/Adult Swim Legion of superheroes - 2006 kidsWB Young Justice (reoccurring appearances) 142.181.136.147 (talk) 03:20, 30 August 2023 (UTC)

SOFIXIT Babysharkboss2 (talk) 19:41, 19 September 2023 (UTC)

The first superhero

Can we say that Superman was the first superhero. The Phantom can be just considered a fictional "hero" not "superhero" same can be said who appeared before Superman. Support if you agree with me oppose if you disagree. Vote now! Kazama16 (talk) 22:13, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

I think the article as it is discusses the issue with appropriate nuance. Kurzon (talk) 11:05, 22 September 2023 (UTC)

I provided source for saying "Superman was the first superhero with superpowers" so this part of sentence shouldn't even be a problem. Kazama16 (talk) 07:27, 24 September 2023 (UTC)

Also The Phantom wasn't the first superhero that was important or popular worldwide. Superman was the first superhero to get mainstream recognition so saying "Superman was the first "major" superhero" can't be considered wrong. Kazama16 (talk) 07:33, 24 September 2023 (UTC)

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