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User talk:W. Frank

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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by W. Frank (talk | contribs) at 19:52, 10 April 2007 (→This should make things clear: can you be a liitle bit clearer?). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Revision as of 19:52, 10 April 2007 by W. Frank (talk | contribs) (→This should make things clear: can you be a liitle bit clearer?)(diff) ← Previous revision | Latest revision (diff) | Newer revision → (diff)

Welcome! (We can't say that loudly enough!)

Here are a few links you might find helpful:

You can sign your name on talk pages and votes by typing ~~~~; our software automatically converts it to your username and the date.

If you have any questions or problems, no matter what they are, leave me a message on my talk page. Or, please come to the new contributors' help page, where experienced Wikipedians can answer any queries you have! Or, you can just type {{helpme}} on your user page, and someone will show up shortly to answer your :questions.

We're so glad you're here! --Simonkoldyk 18:44, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Thank you very much for your warm and helpful welcome!

As a non-native English speaker I'm always a bit worried that my contribution will be unintelligible.

{{helpme}}

Have I done anything wrong by creating a new article? W. Frank 18:54, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

No, you haven't. Be bold in updating pages! I've also answered this on Talk:Cabragh House. --ais523 10:01, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

PS: I'm originally from Dresden in Germany but was a foundling by the occupying British forces after the firestorm. I'm semi-retired now. W. Frank 18:54, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

{{helpme}} I noticed that Misplaced Pages doesn't have an article on the oldest primary school in New Zealand and I don't feel qualified to write one. Instead I've e-mailed the current Principal of Nelson Central School and suggested he contribute one - was that a silly thing to do? W. Frank 19:00, 4 December 2006 (UTC)


{{helpme}}

Why do I have two distinctly10:22, 6 December 2006 (UTC)W. Frank different user pages?

The older (helpful) one is at http://en.wikipedia.org/User_talk:W_Frank and the newer (blank) one is at: http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=User_talk:W._Frank&redirect=no

?? W. Frank 10:22, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

You are User:W. Frank; the other page is at User talk:W Frank (notice the . after the initial initial in your username). User talk:W Frank should be deleted because it corresponds to a non-existent user; if you find the information useful, you can copy it to this page first; to request its deletion, place {{db-nouser}} on the page (in this case; there is a different tag for each speedy deletion reason). --ais523 10:47, 6 December 2006 (UTC)
(edit conflict) The former (not this page but the other) seems to have been created by mistake, as there is no user account by that name, you can safely ignore it or if you like redirect it here. Michael Billington (talk • contribs) 10:50, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Thank you, one and all!

I've marked the phantom for deletion now ( I hope, I'm so stupid I may have done it wrong again...) W. Frank 10:55, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Nelson Central School

I put a {{prod}} message on Nelson Central School because the article doesn't yet contain any content. I realise that you are waiting for Dr Potaka to respond to your email, but the article could have been created when he replies. Having empty articles make Misplaced Pages look bad. The effect of the message I put on the article is to ensure that it is deleted if nothing happens for five days or so. You could also start the article with information from the Ministry of Education. See how other New Zealand school articles are formatted, for example Logan Park High School.-gadfium 05:10, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Sorry about that. I'm very new to all this and there's a lot to learn. Thank you for your help. My motivation was that I did not like a dead (or red) internal link in my Cabragh House article...
W. Frank 12:20, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Also regarding the Nelson Central School article, any commentary about the article should go onto the article's talk page rather than onto the article itself. This is a general Misplaced Pages convention (see WP:TPG).
--Lost tourist 15:06, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Sorry about that, as you see above, I'm brand new and (hopefully) learning about this wonderful animal every day.

I've also replied to you on your user page and also in the article's talk page.

Just this once, and hopefully just for a few hours (maximum 99) could you leave the article as it is until Dr Potaka or another editor shows up to start it?

Please forgive me for being a Newbie editor. When writing my article for Cabragh House, I noticed a missing link for Nelson Central School. I then e-mailed Dr Potaka, Principal of Nelson Central School, suggesting he create (or delegate members of his staff) to create the missing article.

Subsequently I have received e-mails from others in the Nelson region indicating that he may be temporarily indisposed for the next couple of days.

I suggest, therefore, that you leave the Nelson Central School page in the condition I have reverted it to just now and including the scheduled for deletion box. That way if he, or no other editor, shows up to correct and expand the article, it will be deleted automatically in 5 days and if volunteers (or Dr Potaka himself, since I assume he will also be a Newbie to Misplaced Pages) show up in the meantime they will have a skeleton on which to hang flesh.

Thank you for your tolerance, forbearance and understanding
W. Frank 15:03, 7 December 2006 (UTC)! W. Frank 15:19, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

When I suggested you see how other school articles were formatted, I didn't mean for you to copy the whole article into Nelson Central School. You ended up with a mess of information mostly about the other school. I've now changed the article into a bare-bones article about Nelson Central. It no longer needs the prod. Feel free to improve this article yourself, but don't revert it to the previous mess.-gadfium 19:08, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
But I didn't, gadfium.
According to the edit history, that Revision as of 12:52, 7 December 2006 was made by 89.240.127.10
I may be stupid but I'm not so stupid as to spell it "Neslon Centraql Skool" as that anonymous editor did...

However, I do take your general point and I will go in and try and clean it up a bit later this afternoon. Thank you for your useful and pertinent comments.

W. Frank 15:26, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Your change to Persian Walnut

I reverted your change to Persian Walnut because at the time the walnuts were distributed by merchant marines, who were also, like their civilian counterparts maritime merchants. If I am wrong about this, please explain on the talk page before reverting. Thank you. KP Botany 18:50, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

Mmm. Are we talking here about Royal Marines (the military) who were doing a bit of trading, or the English Merchant Navy (also doing a bit of trading) or what exactly?W. Frank 20:08, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

Diocese of Nelson

I reverted your change to the Anglican Church in Aotearoa, New Zealand and Polynesia link. This is because the name of the diocese is exactly that - with the comma. This is because the Anglican church in NZ is made up of three threads or traditions - Tikanga Pakeha (broadly those of European origin), Tikanga Maori (broadly those of Maori origin) and Tikanga Pasifika (broadly those of Pacific Island origin). The "Aotearoa" part of the name refers to the five Hui Amorangi, the "New Zealand" to the seven Dioceses - both of these split up New Zealand, but differently. So you are right that Aotearoa is New Zealand, but not that the name should have a slash in it. Ringbark 21:55, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for correcting my inadvertent error - I mistakenly thought that this was an example of ignorant grammar rather than a considered ecclesiastical decision. God be with you! W. Frank 13:48, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Appreciate your support on deleters

Thanks frank, it takes a lot to stand up in support for what you feel is worth speaking to. web 2.0 is a great development on line. Hope Fiji can work it out and not have UN intervention.

RoddyYoung 12:43, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Are you threatening me?

Vlad fedorov 17:06, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

No.W. Frank 14:15, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

GRU article

Your comment on GRU page history is uncivil and personal attack. If you continue restoring obvious falsification that GRU was helping Saddam Hussein and would continue personal attack on me, I would report you on administrators noticeboard.Vlad fedorov 17:06, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

We will have to agree to disagree that my comments were an uncivil and personal attack.
This is what I wrote as a comment:
"=== Large scale deletions without consensus ===
At 16:38, 8 April 2007 (UTC) I placed a comment on the talk page of User_talk:Vlad_fedorov who has been conspicuous by
  • his absence from these pages
  • his consecutive deletions, without any prior discussion, of material provided by other editors
This is the exact quote of what I wrote on his user page:
"Misplaced Pages as a community has rules to prevent edit wars.
One of these is the 3RR rule.
If you wish to delete large passages of another editor's work without providing any references, it is more polite to discuss your proposed changes on the article's talk page FIRST.
If you do not, your excisions may be regarded as vandalism.
Please proceed immediately to talk:GRU and discuss your point of view (POV) with fellow editors there before reverting this article again.
If you do not, you run the risk of being blocked from Misplaced Pages.
You may find that Misplaced Pages:Wikiquette provides some helpful guidance. Thank you for your anticipated compliance."
Within less than half an hour (and without any further discussion or comment) at 17:05, 8 April 2007 Vlad fedorov had expunged my comments using the following as his edit summary: "Personal offence removed"
I am posting my comments here because I have a strong suspicion that any further help I offer on Vlad fedorov's user pages will also be expunged.W. Frank 17:31, 8 April 2007 (UTC)"
Now I have emphasised some points that I believe are relevant to your deprecated behaviour with regards to GRU, your own talk pages and elsewhere:

Misplaced Pages's contributors come from many different countries and cultures. We have different views, perspectives, and backgrounds, sometimes varying widely. Treating others with respect is key to collaborating effectively in building an encyclopedia.

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If you really continue to regard any of this as a personal attack (as opposed to an attack on your intolerable attempts at political censorship) then I think it would indeed be a very good idea to "report on administrators noticeboard" - perhaps I should not have pointed you towards the WP articles referenced above.W. Frank 14:38, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

I have published the first text on case of Alexey Galkin so-called "confessions". The other texts would follow shortly. Especially on the allegation of hiding Saddam Hussein's "weapons of mass destruction" and allegations of promoting the terrorism. I advise you, as you are not competent in Russian and couldn't study Russian sources which are usually not published by Western media, to stop your dispute. I would like to note that both of the articles I use in my text about Alexey Galkin are from Novaya Gazeta - which is anti-Putin newspaper. One of their journalists was Anna Politkovskaya. Both of the articles are supportive of Alexey Galkin. They contain not only the interview and transcript of "confession", but also comments of the newspaper journalists and conclusion of phsychologist who has studied the videotape of Galkin "confessions". Moreover, the transcript of Alexey Galkin press conference which was interrupted in two places by Abu Movsaev is telling enough about voluntarity of these confessions. If I would describe in such way all accounts of false allegations in this article, the article itself would be bigger and contain rather irrelevant information, than infromation on ]. Vlad fedorov 08:02, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

I don't really think that my user talk pages (or yours) are the place to discuss this. Please take this to talk:GRU and discuss your point of view (POV) with fellow editors there. W. Frank 14:43, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Warrenpoint Ambush

W.Frank, firstly howiya! secondly the terrorism category in the - the term terrorism is a divisive and largely POV term and is outlined as a term to be avoided by wiki. It is usually used where the target of an attack was specifically civilians. I know you didn't add the cat but you replaced it, however, it is an incorrect and POV category - unless you think the British Army targeted the civilian they killed because they thought he was a civilian and are happy to write into the article that the British Army are terrorists for killing the civilian then I would suggest that this category does not suit this article.

P.S. I am always happy to help in any way and I am always contactable on my talk page. regards --Vintagekits 15:20, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

1) Good day to you, Sir! Thank you for your friendly offer of assistance and for your tone of voice. I try and steer clear of controversy since there seem to be so many more impolite editors on Misplaced Pages these days.
2) I do so agree with your point of view regarding less inflammatory wording in article text - however, in categorisations we need to be brief and pithy - a bit like a tabloid headline, in fact.
However, if you check the edit logs for the article Warrenpoint Ambush you will see that I did not restore, add or replace the Category:Terrorist incidents in the 1970s.
It was already there in the version by the previous editor user:One Night In Hackney. Please see http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Warrenpoint_Ambush&oldid=121540790 if you doubt my veracity.
My general policy is to have as many helpful categorisations as possible since it helps readers explore the wonderful source of knowledge that is Misplaced Pages - especially children.
Now, I wonder if we can continue to discuss this at Misplaced Pages:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2007_April_9#Category:IRA_killings
Since I'm always reluctant to censor the Good Faith efforts of others, may I ask you to copy edit this dialogue there?
3) Sadly, in this era of assymetrical warfare the concept of civilian has rather lapsed. I was a foundling in the smoking ruins of a city that was "terrorised" by the American hero Winston S Churchill and his Terrorflieger. Do you not think the categorisation is correct since the Warrenpoint Ambush article records one of the greatest military defeats of the British Army in recent years?W. Frank 15:45, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

This should make things clear

Why do I edit Irish Republicanism articles? Perhaps because they needed improving? I'll take selected examples from my user page.

The latest version that you edited is much more encyclopaedic and multi-faceted; well done and you must be proud of all your hard work!
I'll look at the other articles when I have time - please be patient.

W. Frank 19:41, 10 April 2007 (UTC)


So is it unreasonable for an editor with an interest in a certain subject area to concentrate on that subject area, considering the terrible state of those articles? Should the editor be branded as a "comrade" for improving the articles? I don't think so. One Night In Hackney303 18:27, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

I think you have to make allowances for language confusion here. I don't regard the terms republican or comrade pejorative (of themselves and obviously it depends on the context). It would greatly assist progress and trust if you would answer three simple straight questions with three simple straight answers and not by answering a question with a question:
1) Do you regard yourself as an Irish Republican?
2) Do you regard being identified as a republican to be a personal attack or shameful in any way?
3) Do you regard yourself as a complete loner with no sympathy or comradely feelings towards any organised political grouping with an Irish focus?

And for the avoidance of doubt, I would answer "Yes" to all three of the above as Strathclyde Police (my next door neighbours would attest).W. Frank 19:52, 10 April 2007 (UTC)