Talk:Race (human categorization)

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October 21, 2003	Brilliant prose	Nominated
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Pseudoscientific (?) categorization

In the newest revision of this page (5 July 2024) someone changed "categorization..." to "pseudoscientific categorization..." in the beginning of the article, without changing the rest of the definition or adding references. In my opinion, that is a big claim and should at least be cited, if not removed completely, especially because it's the first thing users see after opening the article. Without proper expansion of that claim, I think it does not belong to this article Wojtek703 (talk) 10:19, 7 July 2024 (UTC)

In my opinion, Pseudoscience should be in the very part of Misplaced Pages where this article is best ordered in. And the historical part can, of course, stay pretty much unaltered.

In Germany, we - by law - have no concept of race. IMHO people mean ethnicity or phenotype when they say race. Racism does exist, but german law dictates that it stems from pseudoscience, mixing a correlation (not causation) of genotype/phenotype with stereotypes. Back on topic: every single "source" and claim in here should be even stronger scrutinized. FeltFurHeartAndSoulfelt (talk) 13:27, 26 August 2024 (UTC)

Quality of writing

While I am quite far from being racist and I do want to learn how/why a race is a social construct and I am open to believe it, the first two, being the second one pretty too extensive, sections of this article are about, in essence, 20 times repeating that it is a social construct but 0 times explaining why. Why are physical commonalities in those socially constructed races notoriously common? I fail to possess the motivation to read another 100 notions of the race really but really being a social construct to finish this article in a mere hope there is somewhere deep down at the end some actual explanation. Especially when the social and behavioral commonalities were already repeatedly explained. 2A00:11B7:393D:2B01:3921:D38E:78F8:B105 (talk) 17:11, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

Defining Race

I think it would be good to include some historical scholarly definitions, such as Blumenbach, Darwin. Private Bean (talk) 06:53, 7 August 2024 (UTC)

Erasmus Darwin? Dimadick (talk) 10:20, 8 August 2024 (UTC)

Modern science regards...

"Modern science regards race as a social construct", in the opening section. This is weasel wording. You have three American sources for this statement. Later in the article international surveys show such an idea is common *only* in America. It's my understanding that American bias should be avoided, especially when claiming to speak for modern science. This sentence should be changed to reflect the lack of international consensus. Something like "The status of race as a biological or social construct continues to be debated." Raffelate (talk) 09:11, 9 October 2024 (UTC)

Hi. British guy here. And no. Just no. Race is socially constructed. Just ask anybody from any group who's perceived race depends on the context of who's asking and why. "Scientific" racism is pure pseudoscience. That's not just an American idea. That is the global consensus. By all means add another source that is not American if you like but we will not be bothsidesing racism with a statement like "The status of race as a biological or social construct continues to be debated". Those really would be weasel words which open the door to a spurious legitimisation of "scientific" racism. DanielRigal (talk) 12:09, 9 October 2024 (UTC)

Excuse me but as I understand it Misplaced Pages is edited according to a range of published material, not your personal opinion. Raffelate (talk) 13:48, 9 October 2024 (UTC)

It's not a personal opinion, it is the plain language of the cited sources. Misplaced Pages uses a range of published material, but that doesn't mean that it seeks a WP:FALSEBALANCE between the mainstream and the fringe. MrOllie (talk) 14:00, 9 October 2024 (UTC)

Surveys in even America do not support the claim that it is remotely close to "fringe". The fact that the idea is entertained in academia, let alone held by significant numbers as shown in Ann Morning's survey, preclude such a claim. Please explain how you arrived at such an assessment. Raffelate (talk) 14:11, 9 October 2024 (UTC)

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