Misplaced Pages:Sockpuppet investigations/Wildhartlivie

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Wildhartlivie

Wildhartlivie (talk · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · spi block · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki)

Populated account categories: confirmed

For archived investigations, see Misplaced Pages:Sockpuppet investigations/Wildhartlivie/Archive.

Report date July 1 2009, 23:45 (UTC)

Suspected sockpuppets

LaVidaLoca (talk · tag · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · spi block · block log · CA · CheckUser(log) · investigate · cuwiki)

Evidence submitted by Viriditas

Wildhartlivie says that LaVidaLoca is his WP:ROOMMATE account and that they share the same IP but use different computers. While this may be true or not, they edit the same articles, revert for each other during edit wars and disputes, , defend each other in disputesand use the same or similar but unique language and phrasing in their edit summaries and talk pages. ("w/", "completely", "&", "yet another", "???" ) There are few, if any overlapping edits, and the LaVidaLoca account appears to only edit articles when Wildhartlivie is inactive. Viriditas (talk) 23:45, 1 July 2009 (UTC)

Comments by accused parties See Defending yourself against claims.

I was not notified of this but I assume I am also being accused. I do stay with Wildhartlivie sometimes, a lot during the last several months. I don't choose to say why, that is personal. We have shared residences at different times in our lives. When that happens, we share an internet connection, but I don't always edit here from home. I don't know of a policy against two people from the same house working on Misplaced Pages or having an interest in the same topics. We grew up together, we went to school together. Because of that, we share many interests and other personal life things. One of those things is a great love of movies and actors and we usually think a lot alike. That happens when people remain friends all their lives. I have some of the same articles that she does on my watchlist. Our wake/sleep hours aren't congruent so we are rarely home together and awake when I am staying with her. I won't post personal contact information here to let anyone that wants take advantage of it.

She taught me how to edit on Misplaced Pages when I became interested. She directs me to policies when I need them and taught me how to use Wiki markup and insert links when it is needed. I don't think there is a lot of similarity in how we write, but I've seen her writing for over 30 years and she's seen mine. As for using w/ and & in edit summaries, Viritidas probably hasn't been a waitress. That's standard shorthand for writing down orders and I see it in a lot of edit summaries by other people. Wildhartlivie and I have both been waitresses during our lives. Saying "completely" is sort of a colloquialism for our group so that might creep in a lot. So is "totally" and sometimes so is "cool". I don't know about "yet another" and that seems like a stretch to me.

I don't see any evidence of being involved in edit wars or disputes or defending one another. I posted a personal attack message at after that person left a an attack at . That wasn't defending anyone in a dispute. It's a personal attack warning. I saw that she had an issue on Jonestown earlier in the morning with a new editor and decided to try and take care of that myself because of the dispute that was going on there with Viritidas. What was going on with the new editor had nothing to do with the dispute with Viriditas so there was no defending her edits. It mostly was about that person changing categories and moving a photo directly underneath the infobox. I admit it that I let it become a little bit of an edit war with the new editor and I'm sorry if that was the situation. If I have done something wrong on Misplaced Pages it was my doing, noone else's, but I don't see that I did. I am willing to be banned or have my account deleted if I have done something wrong, but there is no collusion or meatpuppet activities taking place. The truth is, this whole thing has made me rethink my interest in Misplaced Pages. This is supposed to be a fun place to edit, not one where people get accused and attacked. It is wrong to try and seek punishment to Wildhartlivie for something that she or I did not do or I did wrong. LaVidaLoca (talk) 05:25, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

Comments by other users

I have no knowledge of Wilhartlivie or his room mate, nor is this information directly relevant to IP searching, etc., but it is worth a short mention: undisclosed above is that Viriditas has engaged in a long and extensive Wikihounding campaign against Wildhartlive, myself and Yachtsman1, that is now the subject of an RfCU. I won't go into details, but it includes NUMEROUS false charges and conspiracy theories.Mosedschurte (talk) 01:28, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

Where is the abuse? I see a few examples of editing the same article over the span of years, but no real pattern of long term abuse that warrants any sort of action from two editors who share the same address. I also noted overlap on June 4, 2009 at 1:27 p.m. between the two editors. Also, please take note of this: and compare with this pointed edit: The "defending" each other allegation involves a sock who was banned, and with whom the initator of this investigation also had differences. --Yachtsman1 (talk) 01:53, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

They certainly are acting as sockpuppets. The same articles, the same times, and the same tone. Coincidence? I think not. --64.29.148.60 (talk) 04:33, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

BUSTED - If they are really roommates, then why do they post to each others talk pages like strangers? Just a few examples:

It is clear that the roommate story is a big lie.

If you check the all the IP's used for both accounts, I bet more accounts will show up. Then there will be more "we live together but comment on each other talk pages like we do know each other" explanations —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.83.212.19 (talk) 05:19, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

I don't understand how anyone could look at the three edits above, and leap to the conclusion that "the roommate story is a big lie". This issue is more serious, and requires something more consequential. The first edit is a welcome message placed on LaVidaLoca's page. It's main function is to provide a link to Misplaced Pages guidelines, and Wildhartlivie has confirmed she has helped LaVidaLoca with policies. Isn't the template the simplest way of doing this? The second edit is an acknowledgment. That is does not start "thanks old friend" does not prove any attempt to talk "like strangers". In fact the second part of the message is unclear and somewhat vague, and suggests familiarity, rather than an effort to disguise familiarity. The third one is a completely neutral comment that is as brief as it needs to be. Why would it require any kind of familiarity in conveying this piece of information? A bland piece of information doesn't need more than a bland message. It seems tenuous at best. I also feel that the examples ("w/", "completely", "&", "yet another", "???") given are not particularly idiosyncratic. I've used all but "w/" in my own edit summaries over the years, but I'm familiar with "w/" as a fairly common abbreviation. LaVidaLoca mentions it's used by waitresses, and I've never been a waitress, but I have seen it used in a clerical context. It seems to me that if an idiosyncratic language is causing suspicion, that these are not very strong examples. Find a common word that is consistently mispelled or a phrase that's used in an incorrect context, and that would be somewhat more unique. I just don't see suspicion in any of these things as presented.

It seems to be that some who have commented here have done so with their mind's already set and the comments of the two anons who commented before me, seem very set, but also very lacking in anything but a point of view. If you at least consider the possibility that Wildhartlivie and LaVidaLoca are being truthful, their editing patterns do not appear so suspicious. They've commented that they've been friends for a very long time, so it's natural that they would have a common set of interests, and that their language may even be common. I have friends that would edit the same type of articles as I edit, if they ventured into Misplaced Pages, so I don't disbelieve that two long standing friends may edit from a similar set of articles. I've been aware of Wildhartlivie for a considerable period of time, longer than I have communicated with her, but I have talked and edited with her for over a year. We have also maintained a private correspondence and I am aware of some of the world in which she lives. The person who edits as LaVidaLoca has often been mentioned or referred to as part of a group of family/friends when we have communicated, and the information that has been disclosed here recently, was disclosed to me some time ago, when there was no real need to provide me with a story, if it was only a story. There are two many small details throughout that indicate to me that there are two different people whose paths cross in the real world on a frequent basis. To a lesser extent I have also communicated with LaVidaLoca. As for their editing pattern well, here's a possibility. Consider that Wildhartlivie has health issues, and that she has a lot of free time. She chooses to spend it editing Misplaced Pages and Misplaced Pages is clearly an important interest to her. LaVidaLoca has more of a passing interest, and edits less frequently, and with less depth, but when she edits, it's understandable that she may look at the edits of Wildhartlivie. It's also possible that if she sees Wildhartlivie in some kind of disagreement, that she might step forward. It doesn't seem like an unnatural reaction for a friend, in fact, I think a friend almost certainly look to see what the other friend is working on, and once they've looked they may find it even more difficult not to react. Maybe she's protective, maybe she is used to providing support or maybe she just plain agrees with Wildhartivie. It doesn't follow automatically that they are setting out to work in tandem and to deceive the wider community. I can't offer any proof to support my opinion, but it is not something I take lightly and I base it on what I've observed over a long period of time. I would hope that anyone would at least look at the issue from each side. Assume the two editors are being dishonest and it all looks suspicious, but assume the editors are being truthful and there is very little to establish that there is any kind of intentional misconduct. Rossrs (talk) 14:32, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

Clerk, patrolling admin and checkuser comments

Conclusions

Category:

Open SPI cases