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Early comments
I removed parts of the article that were lifted from the mission statement. -- Notheruser 12:27 14 Jun 2003 (UTC)
I am not sure that LC is best known for its school of law. Sometime, I will write more about LC. (I am an LC alum.) I don't think LC Law was the first law school in Oregon. Willamette began its lawschool in 1883. Clipdude 20:21 30 Jun 2003 (UTC)
I hate to be much of a stickler for details, but the college is pretty insistent that the "and" is an ampersand (&) and not the actual word. I work at the school and have been instructed a number of times to make sure that this is so. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.21.141.81 (talk • contribs) 16:27, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
Merging
Two of the many reasons why the Odell page should be merged with the main LC page: (1) "Freshies" is not an Odell-specific term, and (2) the Odell page is filled with spelling and grammatical errors that are not caught because it is such a marginal page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sstigler (talk • contribs) 04:19, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
- .... a few more reasons: Odell is small, and not justified in having its own page compared to the other halls on campus. Odell is part of Lewis and Clark. Many of the issues the Odell page mentions (co-ed bathrooms, heating, freshies, etc) are not exclusive to odell. Odell has no identity separate from Lewis & Clark. Also, the page is clearly biased toward those living in Odell; much of the information on the page is untrue and favors odell (ie, it is a favored location for returning students). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.175.43.111 (talk • contribs) 23:44, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
Notable People
What exactly is the criteria for being listed as a notable professor at LC? There's no doubt that everyone listed is excellent, but should a term such as "notable" be reserved only for those who are widely recognized outside the LC community? (That is not really directed at those listed now, but for possible future entries)
Along those lines, it seems to me that new pages should be made for the notable person when they are added, so that (if nothing else) others may understand why they are so "notable".
What do others think?
- If they're not notable enough to have a Misplaced Pages page, in most cases I don't think they should be listed. There are a couple exceptions though, since the deletionists are running rampant lately. --Liface 02:39, 8 October 2006 (UTC)
(Anon here).
There seems to be professor-crush creep on the notable list. I axed a few. Reflect on the wikipedia notability page for academics before restoring or adding new ones, please. We all like L&C, but at the rate people are going pretty soon you'll be giving L&C an award for most humble school.
http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Notability_(academics)
Merge Proposal
The Lewis & Clark College Co-op article should be a section on this article, as opposed to a separate article. Otebig (talk) 01:01, 29 March 2008 (UTC)
Bicycling at LCC
I removed this paragraph:
- Portland is widely regarded as North America's best city for commuting by bicycle,<ref>{{cite web | first = Chris | last = Korbey | title = Transparency: Cycling to Work | publisher = Good Magazine | date = October 13, 2009 | url = http://www.good.is/post/transparency-biking-to-work | accessdate = 2009-12-11 }}</ref> and some Lewis & Clark students and faculty commute by bicycle. The college's administration supports commuting by bicycle or other means of sustainable transportation, and students who commute by bike or ride for fun are supported by a student run bicycle co-op that provides tools, spare parts, and informal tutorials on bicycle repair.<ref>{{cite web | title = About Lewis & Clark: Transportation | publisher = Lewis & Clark Website | url = http://www.lclark.edu/about/sustainability/topics/transportation | accessdate = 2009-12-11 }}</ref> Cycling is also available as a for-credit physical education course.
The connection between Portland bicycling to LCC bicycling seems tenuous- it doesn't really say anything about the school, let alone about the number of students commuting by bicycle. I've added it here so it can be returned if decent refs are found to support it. Otherwise, it seems a bit of puffery about the school. tedder (talk) 18:33, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- I had already gutted some of the paragraph and other items (most recently added) for the same reasons. I think someone from the school's marketing department has taken on the article, as they keep saying the College. Maybe time for some COI tags and other friendly reminders. Aboutmovies (talk) 18:36, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- It could just be enthusiasm for the school. It doesn't look terrible now that we've refactored, so I'm not really enthusiastic about a big COI tag on the article. tedder (talk) 18:40, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- Nice cleanup, guys. It was on my short round tuit after the recent activity. —EncMstr (talk) 19:11, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- For what it's worth I made some of the contributions that were deleted. I'm an LC alum and I've never worked for the marketing department. I sincerely apologize if some of my contributions were not encyclopedic/too enthusiastic. I decided to work on the article because I currently work in rural Malawi and I get pretty bored; not because I aim to lionize LC. I'll try not to sound so favorable in future contributions.
(Isaac.holeman (talk) 22:38, 11 December 2009 (UTC))
Community Character and Traditions
I'd like to add notes about the character and traditions of LC. I believe such information, conveyed appropriately, is encyclopedic and consistent with more thorough Misplaced Pages articles for other universities (see Reed College or Stanford University for examples).
Some of my recent contributions have been rapid fire deleted in whole, so to proactively avoid an edit war, I'm adding proposed contributions for this section to the talk page first, and I request feedback and further edits for at least a day or two before I move content to the main page. Please edit to improve new content rather than wholly disregarding information about important student organizations and activities. - (Isaac.holeman (talk) 22:59, 11 December 2009 (UTC))
- Here's the question- how does a section on a cappella groups contribute to the article? Misplaced Pages isn't a brochure for the school, and there's nothing notable about the hobbies of students, especially since it hasn't been recognized with a notable national award or coverage in a reliable source. If, for instance, the New York Times wrote an article about the a cappella meme at LCC, it might be worth mentioning. As is, what does Misplaced Pages gain by having flowery prose about this?
- Finally, arguing that other pages have sections is a shaky argument- see WP:OSE. tedder (talk) 23:11, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
- Valid point about WP:OSE, and I would like to emphasize that I'm not defending any specific language I've put forward thus far (previous language may have sucked due to boosterism, I apologize). I do argue, however, that information about student organizations and traditions is relevant to Lewis & Clark as it is portrayed on Misplaced Pages.
- "There is nothing notable about the hobbies of students, especially since it hasn't been recognized with a notable national award or coverage in a reliable source." I disagree with this statement. The article on Academic Boosterism states that "Motivated editors should direct their energies towards describing all the various aspects of an institution to a broader audience rather than emphasizing its quality" (emphasis mine). A wikipedia article on a college is only useful if it covers enough topics to help readers understand how that particular college compares and contrasts with other similar colleges. Student's extra curricular activities, hobbies, and cultural traits are extremely relevant to explaining the unique characteristics of a college - how else are readers to differentiate the hundreds of small liberal arts colleges that have the same small classes, large endowments, and crappy sports teams?
- A specific student body's hobby (a sports team or a vocal group) probably only meets Misplaced Pages's Notability Guidelines for creation of a new stand-alone article if it has, as you suggest, received a notable national award. However, these notability requirements apply to creation/deletion of stand-alone articles, they do not apply independently to each minor subsection within a larger article. The Notability guidelines state that "Verifiable facts and content not supported by multiple independent sources may be appropriate for inclusion within another article."
- LC's a cappella groups are relevant to anyone who is interested in Lewis & Clark because they involve a very large number of students. The existence of this activity is verified by the current article on the front page of the LC website, and as well the vocal group has made their own website and posted recordings of their music online. Such non-independent sources are not sufficient to justify creation of a new stand-alone article, but publication by a non-independent source, speaking about itself, is sufficient to justify a small subsection within a larger article.
- These same arguments apply to other student organizations and traditions, such as the student co-op, which was apparently merged with this article only to be deleted entirely at a later date. - (Isaac.holeman (talk) 01:03, 12 December 2009 (UTC))
- I agree that most of the stuff added was boosterish crap, and I removed much of it, and tagged other items as needing citations from third-party reliable sources, not the school. I also agree that there is a place in the article for some of these activities, as notability only applies to if we have a stand-alone article. But, and this is a big but, that still doesn't mean we cover everything and cover it in-depth. Besides the notability guidelines we have approximately 3000 other guidelines and policies. One of which is of particular note here is the neutral point of view. To quote some key points: "All Misplaced Pages articles and other encyclopedic content must be written from a neutral point of view, representing fairly, and as far as possible without bias, all significant views that have been published by reliable sources." "Neutrality requires that the article should fairly represent all significant viewpoints that have been published by a reliable source, and should do so in proportion to the prominence of each."
- Or in other words, out of all the coverage of L&C, how much of it is on a cappella groups or the bike club versus say a certain former president and his financial dealings? Or on the plans to expand the campus, or even on the swine flu and a student death as a result? And this is not just a pure number of sources, but we should also take into account the reach of the sources. An article in Willamette Week reaches a much bigger audience than the school's newspaper.
- So where does that leave us. Mention the groups, but in proportion and in context. For an example, see Dartmouth College, which is an FA class article (the best Misplaced Pages has to offer) and a small liberal arts school (I'll add a re-write below for that specific portion). Aboutmovies (talk) 08:08, 12 December 2009 (UTC)
- These same arguments apply to other student organizations and traditions, such as the student co-op, which was apparently merged with this article only to be deleted entirely at a later date. - (Isaac.holeman (talk) 01:03, 12 December 2009 (UTC))
a cappella music
Student led a cappella groups are a relatively recent development but have quickly become popular among Lewis & Clark undergraduates. In 2005 a group of students formed Momo & the Coop. Since then four additional groups have formed, two albums have been released, and students formed the Acabrella Union to foster further development of the a cappella scene at Lewis & Clark.
Although a cappella group members are not awarded academic credit, they aim to bring an academic component to their work, for example enlisting music composition majors to arrange the a cappella renditions of many of the songs on their most recent album, Joh Eh Ba Dop. Performances range from numerous small events at alumni gatherings or house parties, to the most well attended student performances at Lewis & Clark.
- Beginning in 2005, a total of five a cappella groups have formed at the school. These groups have about XXX participants and have produced two albums. (yep, one line should do it)