Misplaced Pages

This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Amalthea (talk | contribs) at 21:05, 2 February 2012 (→Paraphrase, but how?: Thanks, SandyGeorgia). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Hello, and welcome to my talk page. If I post on a talk page please respond there. I'll be watching it for a while. No need to {{talkback}} me unless you think I missed it. If you start a conversation here, I'll reply here (unless you request otherwise, here or on your talkpage), so please watch this page. ⇒ Start a new Talk topic.

Mass deletion for MOTD

Hi

Could you batch delete all the dates like you used to when requested for the 2011 mottoes? The dates in question can be found at Misplaced Pages:Motto of the day/Schedule/Archive 2011 (but don't delete this page). Cheers. Simply south...... having large explosions for 5 years 21:09, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

A few months are gone already, I'll keep April–November for a bit to try and debug some annoying Twinkle or MediaWiki API error. :)
Amalthea 11:58, 22 January 2012 (UTC)

Unblock on hold

There is an unblock request at User talk:216.17.107.51. The IP is subject to two range blocks, one of which was imposed by you. (A checkuserblock, from 13:32, 11 January 2012 to 216.17.96.0/20 13:32, 25 January 2012.) The other is a proxy block, which I will refer to Misplaced Pages:WikiProject on open proxies. Perhaps you could consider whether there is a case for lifting your block or not. JamesBWatson (talk) 11:30, 20 January 2012 (UTC)

Answered there. Amalthea 11:04, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

Detecting public IPs

I am curious how you are able to find out that the IP for 125.7.71.6 is a public access WiFi hotspot address. I was only able to trace it to Macquarie Telecom in Sidney but no further. Thanks. Jojalozzo 17:44, 21 January 2012 (UTC)

Because I trust myles325a and he said so. :) Amalthea 17:49, 21 January 2012 (UTC)

Ah! So no magic tools, just good connections - plain old detective work. :-) Thanks! Jojalozzo 02:31, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

Notice of Administrators' Noticeboard discussion

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. The thread is "Unblock request on User:125.7.71.6". Thank you. Qwyrxian (talk) 02:10, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

OK. Amalthea 11:04, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

A request

Hello. Thanks for your reply on the Twinkle talk page Located Here regarding my proposal to add the {{Find sources}} parameter to the Article for deletion template Located Here. I'm not sure if this is the right venue, but since you're an administrator, I am requesting that if appropriate, could you go to the discussion occurring at Template talk:Article for deletion and strike out User:Mtking's multiple Oppose votes. They have voted "oppose" three times in bold, and I feel that it is misleading and casts an oppositional tone on the page. If I'm not mistaken, it's also against voting guidelines on Misplaced Pages.

I ask because I am hesitant to correct this problem myself, to avoid further unconstructive complications with this invididual. I've posted a request on the discussion page to the user to strike their multiple votes, but they haven't responded. It is biasing the discussion page. It also appears that the person may be engaging in some intentional obfuscation while not actually reading comments in the discussion, as evidenced on the Twinkle talk page, which you commented on. Please respond at your convenience on my talk page, and thank you for your consideration.

Sincerely, Northamerica1000 13:18, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

• Never mind, I've closed the discussion. It wasn't receiving much input. Northamerica1000 08:14, 24 January 2012 (UTC)
  • OK. I was waiting to see for Mtking's response to your request before getting involved, but I agree that the discussion wasn't really getting anywhere at this point. Amalthea 08:59, 24 January 2012 (UTC)

Personal Version of Twinkle

Would you please clarify at Wikipedia_talk:Twinkle#Twinkle_localization_to_Bengali_Wikipedia whether having a personal version of twinkle is possible anymore? If its possible, it'd be great if instructions on how to get one were available. Best regards--Siddhartha Ghai (talk) 17:49, 24 January 2012 (UTC)

OK, I've replied there. I haven't followed the thread so far, so I'm not sure whether that's actually going to be helpful. :) Amalthea 18:29, 24 January 2012 (UTC)

Suspected Sockpuppet

Hello Amalthea. I appear to have found another sock puppet of Asgardian, User: Mistersaxon4. Judging from how Mistersaxon4 edits and leave edit summaries as shown here (), I think Asgardian is using this account to evade his ban on Misplaced Pages. Can I request usercheck for this? Abhijay (☎ Talk) (✐ Deeds) 12:18, 26 January 2012 (UTC)

Can you give me a specific example of an edit summary that would match Asgardian? Aston Villa F.C. would be an unusual topic for him. Amalthea 12:53, 26 January 2012 (UTC)

One example of an edit summary Asgardian usually used was rv. I'm not sure, but remember how he used PurpleHeartEditor and did a huge bunch of edits that were similar to his edit summaries? Well I think this is the case as well. Abhijay (☎ Talk) (✐ Deeds) 15:10, 26 January 2012 (UTC)

"rv" is probably one of the most common edit summaries, that by itself doesn't mean anything. FWIW, Mistersaxon4 has used that edit summary once, PurpleHeartEditor never, Asgardian never in his last 5000 edits, and I thrice.
Don't let me do your work for you, you must have noticed something specific that prompted this section, give me diffs please.
Amalthea 15:30, 26 January 2012 (UTC)

SPI of Tartanator

I don't know what the entire point of this is, since Nodar95 claims WP:CLEANSTART, and if I and Tartanator were indeed the same person, a block for something that occurred 8 weeks ago would be rhetorical. It seems to be a waste of everybody's time and could boomerang back at Nodar95 for some of the statements he has made. What do you think? GotR 14:05, 26 January 2012 (UTC)

Since you have also replied at the SPI case page I've replied there, to keep the discussion in one place. Amalthea 15:23, 26 January 2012 (UTC)

You got mail. GotR 16:06, 26 January 2012 (UTC)

Received. Amalthea 16:35, 26 January 2012 (UTC)

... and replied. Amalthea 11:57, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

sind deine Ohren brennen?

Bitte anschauen User_talk:Gerda_Arendt/Archive_2012#SLA PumpkinSky talk 23:39, 26 January 2012 (UTC)

War zu langsam. :) Amalthea 08:13, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

Traurig ;-) PumpkinSky talk 10:56, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Random Acts of Kindness Barnstar
	Thank you "Amalthea" for giving me a chance to help out in the Misplaced Pages community. I don't really know what is the criteria for giving these stars, but as I found this while checking out Misplaced Pages, I think you deserve it for giving me a chance even after sockpuppeting. Inlandmamba (talk) 18:27, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

Thanks

Thank you for updating the rolling six month CheckUser data! Risker (talk) 06:22, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

Pumpkin Sky CCI

I'm confused: you're saying here that Pumpkin Sky is Rlevse? Could you please fill me in, per Misplaced Pages:Featured articles/2012 RfC on FA leadership? SandyGeorgia (Talk) 19:40, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

Yes. I don't really have much more information than that, but no doubt that both accounts belong to the same person. Amalthea 19:47, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

Ummmm ... ok ... I've been poking around and now I see all the similarities (that is, if we account for feigned ignorance), but can we say conclusively that they're the same, in terms of understanding his input at both WT:FAC and WT:DYK? If that is the case, we've had a massive upheaval and ongoing disruption at FAC based on not just one, but three returning-from-vanished or cleanstart users, which reinforces the concern about "sour grapes" coming in to play in the politicization of FAC. What evidence is there that PumpkinSky is Rlevse, beyond that it looks like him ? SandyGeorgia (Talk) 19:54, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

Among other things he acknowledged it when I talked to him via email. Everything I know lines up, it is without a doubt  Confirmed.
Interesting regarding the RfC: I saw that he opined there and was concerned by it already, that's a prime example of why WP:SCRUTINY is important; I hadn't been aware that there were other users with a similar history, or of any further disruption that you mention. Amalthea 20:14, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

Thanks. Disgusted. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 20:19, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

Tr:In Bruges

Hi, I'm curious about how you managed to delete it, I've tried with API, normal delete, nuke without any results :) Snowolf 21:56, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

I see now you used the pageid, good idea, didn't occur to me :D Snowolf 21:57, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Contributor copyright investigations/PumpkinSky

Hey Amalthea--if I find a copyvio in a single edit, can I just revdel it with a copyvio note? And if that's OK, do I still need to stick that CCI template on the talk page? Thanks. Hey, I saw this--I don't mind helping, but even reading the instructions isn't easy. And first, I gotta cook dinner and then put the girls to bed. ;) Drmies (talk) 23:34, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

Heh, I was hoping to channel (guilt) some energy into the cleanup that way. :)
I'm really not the right person to ask though, there's a reason why I stuck to the trivial edits. :) I would have thought it sufficient to make sure any text you found is either removed or rewritten. I'm sure MRG had a good reason to create {{Cclean}} though, so maybe it's best to ask at WT:CCI or one of the CCI clerks. I also think that revdel isn't always necessary either -- but really, I'm out of my element there. :\
Amalthea 23:45, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

I look at a long list. Some articles are mine. PumpkinSky was tremendously helpful copy-editing my Germanic prose. Can I just say so in general? Or do I have to check off every single article? Don't we have better things to do??? Loosing such people? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 00:47, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

Well, I just found one, which I why I was asking. As for losing--these are copyright violations and that's a matter that can threaten the whole project, a project in which you have invested considerable time and energy. It's not trivial by any standard. I learned the wiki-ropes a long time ago from someone who instilled the joy of article creation in me, and taught me the importance. Then they got blocked basically for trolling where they didn't get their (political) way, and began socking, finally just trolling. I still find that incredibly sad, but that's the way it is. It's like the friend who teaches you how to play the guitar, but you can't invite him to dinner parties anymore because he keeps spouting racist stuff in conversation. Drmies (talk) 01:07, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

By all means, if you know edits were just copyediting then please check them off.
And well, I agree that there will likely only be a few articles that have to be reworded, but we can't just ignore it either. There is reason to believe that a number of those edits introduced problematic content, turning a blind eye would in the long run damage Misplaced Pages -- maybe not even legally in cases like this, but it would certainly hurt our reputation. And believe me, this was not at all the outcome I was working towards over the last days, but I had little choice when he stopped responding. Admittedly, with what I know now, it was probably bound to end in drama. Amalthea 01:08, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

I checked off 28 articles, only the ones I know that is, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:43, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

Even flawed editors can be incredibly helpful much of the time. This is one of the challenges Misplaced Pages has to deal with on a regular basis. Geometry guy 01:10, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

• I resemble that remark! Drmies (talk) 01:18, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

• Not sure where to put this, so: {{Cclean}} was created in the days before rev deletion when we had two options: either selectively delete the content or remove it from publication and hope it doesn't come back. At that point, it was to help prevent people accidentally restoring the content, because selective deletion was rare and only for really bad cases. :) It's still useful when stuff isn't rev deleted, and even if it is, it's a way of explaining to people what happened to the content they lost. I am inclined to use it less now than I used to - mostly when I think there's a higher chance for editor dismay or confusion and when I think there's a higher chance that the person who added the content actually could be the copyright holder, especially if it was added by an IP. --Moonriddengirl 11:55, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

Paraphrase, but how?

I am setting out to fix instances of "copy-vio" by PumpkinSky.

No 1 Bozeman Carnegie Library, found and addressed as a problem:

• "The building is also opened for special events such as Historic Preservation Week." vs.
• (source) "its new owners have opened the building to the public on numerous occasions for special events, such as Historic Preservation Week."

and

• "Their plan worked as the red-light district and Chinese population steadily dwindled away." vs.
• (source) "the local Chinese population gradually dwindled and Bozeman's red light district soon withered and disappeared."

I admit that I fail to see a problem in this case. Make me understand: Would it be acceptable to say "for example" instead of "such as"? Use a different term for "special events"? Say "conducts special events"? I am completely helpless in the second case. Help!

No 2 Lonesomehurst Cabin, I restored the description and some history. Again, I failed to see close paraphrasing from the public source "United States Department of the Interior / National Park Service". There are architectural terms in the description that I don't know ("rabbitted cornerboards"), so I would not know ho to paraphrase without losing precision?? Please check, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:11, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

Popping over here per your request on my talk; Gerda, it's not only the phrasing-- the problem we often see at DYK (and that folks everywhere fail to pick up on when they use tools like the duplication detector) is that the entire structure is copied. When the flow and structure matches the source, you can see that text was copy-pasted in, then words just juggled around (which avoids duplication detector tool picking it up). These frequent claims that involve "only a few words" come from people who aren't looking at the structure of the article. You can read the source, read the article, and see that you're looking at the same thing with a few words juggled. If you've addressed that, I'm not concerned for a closer look-- feel free to remove the tag if you're satisfied. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 14:10, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

No 3 Cranberry Creek Archeological District, I changed the line "and was designated a State Natural Area in 1986", copied word-for-word from the source. But who thinks that Misplaced Pages is in danger because of such a line? Not me, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:06, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

Again, examine the structure-- not just the words and phrases. Copying the structure is copyvio. See the Plagiarism Dispatch:

Unfortunately, there is no hard and fast rule for how much revision is necessary to avoid plagiarizing. In evaluating copyright concerns, the United States courts adopt a "substantial similarity" test that compares the pattern and sequence of two works, finding such similarity where "the ordinary observer , unless he set out to detect the disparities, would be disposed to overlook them, and regard their aesthetic appeal as the same." Even if all of the language is revised, a court may find copyright infringement under the doctrine of "comprehensive non-literal similarity" if "the pattern or sequence of the two works is similar". Likewise, plagiarism may exist if readers comparing the two works would come away with a sense that one is copied from or too heavily based on another.

I read the source from Lonehurst Cabin, then read the article, and there was no doubt I was reading the same work-- then I engaged Duplication detector to pick up specific instances, but if the structure is copied even if words are juggled, it could still be a problem. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 14:18, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

The article No 3 has many sources, sometimes more than one in one sentence.

The structure in No 2 is now different because I put things in chronology. Repeated: There are architectural terms in the description that I don't know ("rabbitted cornerboards"), so I would not know ho to paraphrase without losing precision?? - There was no tag to be removed, just content restored. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:36, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

Sounds good-- it's OK to use direct quotes on terms like that ... By the way, since MoonRiddenGirl is also on this page, perhaps she'll educate us ... in the Cabin case, the reason I removed text instead of tagging was that a CCI wasn't yet open at that point, and it was my understanding that if you get to a copyvio before other hands have touched it, you should just remove it. Maybe MRG will tell us if that's correct? I also queried her talk since I wasn't certain. SandyGeorgia (Talk) 14:41, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

Thank you for responding, Sandy! Amalthea 21:05, 2 February 2012 (UTC)