Misplaced Pages

This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Jclemens (talk | contribs) at 08:26, 5 May 2012 (→File:Massoud and Qadir 2.PNG: r). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

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Welcome, correspondents If you're here because I deleted an article you think should be undeleted, please read this first and remember--Most of the time, I didn't write the text that appears in the deletion summary.
N.B. I don't respond well to either fawning or abuse. Talk to me like a peer, assume good faith, and you'll find I reciprocate in my helpfulness.

Functionary Assistance My ability to help as a checkuser, oversighter, or arbitrator in individual matters is currently limited by my positional and non-Misplaced Pages obligations. For non-trivial assistance, especially that which requires extensive consideration of private correspondence, you will likely get a faster response by asking another functionary.

Position Essays may help you understand my point of view with regard to...

• Notability of Fictional Topics
• Articles for Deletion
• Blocks
• My RfA Standards

Administrator Goals Doing my best to improve the tiny little wedge in the top center:

Would you mind looking at my last few contributions?

I was reading through today's AfD log and saw that a few relists weren't completed properly. I believe I've repaired them, but didn't have so much experience editing the log manually. Would you double check me? BusterD (talk) 16:36, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

Normally I would, but I'm leaving presently and won't be back on-wiki for several hours. Ask another frequent relister? Cheers, Jclemens (talk) 16:39, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

Will do. Thanks anyway! Enjoy the day! BusterD (talk) 16:42, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

Scottywong was available. Thanks! BusterD (talk) 21:25, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

Glad to hear it all worked out for you! He's a great resource for technical processes behind deletion. Jclemens (talk) 05:09, 10 April 2012 (UTC)

Question about injunctions

Hi Jclemens. The R&I review has a section for proposed temporary injunctions, but I don't know how to go about requesting one. Could you please tell me how to request it?

I'd like to request an injunction that Mathsci be prohibited from interacting with me for the rest of the time that the review is open. Of course I am hoping the results of the review will address the issue in a long-term sense, but in the meantime his pursuit of me has only increased since I first made the request for amendment. I emailed you about a previous example of his publicly bringing up a piece of off-wiki information that isn't findable without extensive research. As of now, you can see here his battleground attitude is extending to my involvement in the paleontology articles I edit. I am having increasing difficulties remaining civil in the face of this baiting and I would really like some sort of remedy to keep this from continuing at least as long as the review is open. -Ferahgo the Assassin (talk) 23:03, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

I have never worked with a temporary injunction before. I suggest you just ask in the appropriate spot on the case page, or on the talk page, such that a clerk can help you through the details. Cheers, Jclemens (talk) 04:44, 10 April 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for your suggestion, though it's now been resolved by Roger Davies. -Ferahgo the Assassin (talk) 11:29, 10 April 2012 (UTC)

Signpost question

Hi Jclemens! I write for the Signpost and I'm working on a series analyzing the work of the Arbitration Committee (a recent story here). Would you be free to answer some questions regarding your work on the Committee, and specifically the ins and outs of the committee mailing list? I see you're a member of the incoming mail team for the committee, and I'm interested in some organizational details. For example:

• Are PD assignments made on the list
• How much discussion about a decision, pre-PD draft, is there

If you would be willing, please ping my talk page. I'd be glad to post questions here or via email, whichever you prefer. Best regards! Lord Roem (talk) 23:48, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

Questions

Here are my questions. Feel free to answer them here or via email, whichever you prefer.

• 1. On the Committee itself, once a case is accepted, how are the drafters for the PD chosen? Is this done via the mailing list, and if so, do members 'vie' or request to draft a specific case? Is selection basically random?

  Selection is basically a volunteer round-robin. Arbs volunteer for specific cases as they have time and interest. We have appointed three drafters in a couple of cases this year, which is 20% of the serving committee on one case. Drafters often say something like "I haven't drafted anything this year so far" or "Well, I have time to do this one, but I've already done two this year...". Junior arbs often take second seat on a case first, but not always. Most of us seem to make suboptimal choices on our first case or two, but somehow the committee and community survives our learning curve.

• 2. During a case, how much internal discussion usually occurs via the mailing list? In your experience, do drafters tend to find consensus early on or does conversation fire up after the posting of a proposed decision?

  It really depends on the nature of the case. When there's substantial disagreement, you will see that in the proposed decisions themselves, such as in Betacommand 3, and the email discussion reflected deliberations of a divided committee. Others will have extensive off-wiki discussion because of the nature of the evidence, like TimidGuy Ban Appeal. ArbCom uses auxiliary mailing lists, which are re-purposed as needed to handle matters in which specific arbitrators are recused.

• 3. When you first joined the Committee, what was your biggest shock or insight you gained through participating in cases? What surprised you?

  I was shocked how many non-public matters the committee handles: allegations of WP:CHILD violations, real-life harassment and threats against Misplaced Pages editors, editors having mental breakdowns... Which is ironic, because I'm quite a bit more professionally qualified to handle those sorts of things than much of the committee's public workload.

• 4. Generally, how much ArbCom mail do you receive? I've heard its crazy, just how so?

  A quick (and possibly inaccurate) count of my mailboxes shows 410 for the month of April to date, so about 45 a day. April has been a light month overall, with only one situation so far that resulted in an exceptional spike in email, so I'm guessing 50 a day would be a ceiling of normal email traffic. We're working on another mailing list such that initial appeals from banned users can go to the ban appeals subcommittee (BASC) and other arbitrators who choose to view that mailing list, and not to the main mailing list. I will be happy when that gets up and running, because BASC traffic is probably 1/4 to 1/3 of the total mail content.

• 5. AGK and other new arbitrators replied in their recent interviews that conversation is more frank and open on the mailing list. Do you find discussions to be calm? Are there occasional heated arguments?

  There are disagreements, sure, but the one thing about the list is that we are all here for Misplaced Pages more than we are for ourselves. Several of us hold exceptionally divergent viewpoints on things, but when it's "just us" on the mailing list, the discussion is handled in a much more ideal manner than a discussion, for example, on AN or ANI. That is, we talk about the real issues, rather than personalities, for the most part, and there's no one egging on drama for drama's sake. I only recall one threat to resign in the 16 months I've been on the list, which was not acted upon--and wasn't related to the committee's own internal workings anyways. Overall, ArbCom is a very high quality group of people, both in terms of their real-life skills, experience, logic, and dedication. The community has done an excellent job of selecting principled and articulate candidates who have justice, fairness, and Misplaced Pages's long-term health in mind.

I appreciate your willingness to help with the story, which is currently slated for May 7th. Best wishes, Lord Roem (talk) 01:39, 10 April 2012 (UTC)

No problem. Jclemens (talk) 05:08, 10 April 2012 (UTC)

Friendly notification regarding this week's Signpost

Hello. This is an automated message to tell you that, as it stands, you are set to be mentioned in this week's Arbitration Report (link). The report aims to inform readers of The Signpost about the proceedings of the Arbitration Committee in a non-partisan manner. Please review the draft article, and, if you have any concerns, feel free to leave them on the talkpage (transcluded in the Comments section directly below the main body of text), where they will be read by a member of the editorial team. Please only edit the article yourself in the case of grievous factual errors (making sure to note such changes in the comments section). Thank you. On behalf of The Signpost's editorial team, LivingBot (talk) 00:00, 16 April 2012 (UTC)

It's actually the "special report 1" :-) Cheers, Jclemens (talk) 02:39, 16 April 2012 (UTC)

Technical connection no longer exists

In light of your recent votes, could you please take a look at this? Since it's my site ban on the table here I want to make sure that this is acknowledged. -Ferahgo the Assassin (talk) 01:26, 21 April 2012 (UTC)

So switching up connectivity somehow negates all the past evidence? I'm sorry, but if you seriously think that changing things around would materially affect the review outcome, you have badly misunderstood the nature of the problem. Jclemens (talk) 01:35, 21 April 2012 (UTC)

This is absolutely relevant! This isn't "switching up connectivity", this is a real-life change in my living situation that I've been trying to get Arbcom's attention about ever since the findings of fact were posted, in the PD talk and on the mailing list. I was worried that after how long I've spent trying to bring attention to this problem it would be too late to address it, but AGK reassured me it wasn't too late.

Based on this comment, the data linking my account to his is from 2010. I'm loathe to mention anything about my private life in public anymore, but the fact is: Occam and I no longer live together. I had thought he was still sometimes going online from the network at my house, but apparently he doesn't anymore and hasn't in months. According to AGK, Occam's connection isn't even in the same town as mine. I was formally topic banned under WP:SHARE, and the reason a site ban is being considered is because I may have violated WP:SHARE with my request for amendment. But WP:SHARE does not apply, and this needs to be considered. -Ferahgo the Assassin (talk) 02:40, 21 April 2012 (UTC)

It needs to be considered? By whom? You do understand that checkuser evidence is not the only basis on which the association has been made, right? Jclemens (talk) 06:42, 21 April 2012 (UTC)

What I mean is that if arbitrators are going to pass a finding of fact that I'm violating WP:SHARE, which is what FoF 3.8 says, they have an obligation to first be sure I actually am violating it. If you think there's enough reason to site-ban me even if I'm not violating it, then that's a different issue. But this shouldn't be included as a reason if it's not true. -Ferahgo the Assassin (talk) 08:09, 21 April 2012 (UTC)

Ferhago, that you are no longer violating SHARE is not as indisputable as you claim. AGK 15:34, 21 April 2012 (UTC)

Indeed. Jclemens (talk) 17:38, 21 April 2012 (UTC)

User:EEMIV

Special:Contributions/EEMIV. 500 edits

• Redirects without discussion
• Actions against consensus of discussion
• Subversion of AfD process
• Use of redirects to bypass the AfD process

EEMIV seems to think that mentioning proposals at the Star Trek project page gives rights superseding the AfD process. So I guess that makes the others at that project page complicit in this as well. I have seen this sort of behaviour before, but it has always been isolated incidents. This user does it habitually, and seems to have the backing of other editors as well. I think a message needs to be sent, that nowhere in WP:REDIRECT does it say that redirects are what you do with articles you do not like and cannot be bothered to nominate for deletion, or that you think might have a chance of being improved later (as many and various guidelines and essays indicate that stubs are for that purpose).

After the decision to Keep by closer, User:Ron Ritzman, at:

Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Ambush (Star Wars: The Clone Wars)

Wholesale redirect of a series of Star Wars The Clone Wars episodes to a list of episodes, against consensus, and without further discussion

http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Hostage_Crisis&diff=362738005&oldid=362702487

Keeps no record of archives on talk page. He has his TALK PAGE locked so only Users can edit it.

Redirects

Plo Koon, redirected to List of Star Wars characters#K

http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Plo_Koon&diff=488578144&oldid=488576242

Talk page. Proves he is not doing redirects for the purposes of WP:REDIRECT #13 : "Sub-topics or other topics which are described or listed within a wider article. (Such redirects are often targeted to a particular section of the article.)"

http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Talk%3APlo_Koon&diff=488578097&oldid=477058778

Redirect (two of many, of Star Trek spaceship articles

http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Starfleet_ship_registry_and_classes_in_Star_Trek&diff=484220024&oldid=482393620

http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=USS_Excelsior&diff=482409508&oldid=478713241

Stubifying, outside of the Star Trek genre

Tropes in Agatha Christie's novels. Made Stub of article.

http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Tropes_in_Agatha_Christie%27s_novels&diff=483753776&oldid=478348348

I stopped after less than a week's worth of Edit History. There is no telling how much material this user has removed from mainspace

Copies of this message sent to editors who participated in the Ambush AfD: User:Ron Ritzman, User:DGG, User:Jclemens, User:Peregrine Fisher, User:Torritorri, and added to the Talk page of the Star Trek Project page, Misplaced Pages talk:WikiProject Star Trek

Anarchangel (talk) 00:47, 29 April 2012 (UTC)

File:Massoud and Qadir 2.PNG

Your speedy closure of File:Massoud and Qadir 2.PNG on Misplaced Pages:Files for deletion/2012 May 3 was out of process. There is no rule against immediate re-nominations, and there are many precedents for such renominations having been accepted (ex.1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6). The standing policy is that any XfD can be revisited at any time, if new arguments are on the table. This was clearly the case here, as explained in my nomination, and in the meantime there had been several fresh good-faith outside !votes.

Do I really have to take this closure of yours to DRV again, only so that we can then finally have yet another FFD? I'm frankly annoyed that the cleanup of an NFCC failure as obvious as this one gets delayed through these kinds of bureaucratic shenanigans. The simple fact is that this image is not the object of commentary in the article; neither the image itself nor even the event it shows is mentioned with as much as a single word. Everybody can see that if they only look at the article. No good-faith wikipedian with half an ounce of experience with NFC could have the slightest doubt that it fails the policy. Fut.Perf. ☼ 07:17, 5 May 2012 (UTC)

Actually, that would be an entirely unwise thing to do. One of the most important parts of working in Misplaced Pages is learning to both understand and accept when consensus is against you. By continuing to harp on NFCC #8, you're entering WP:IDHT territory. Your renomination had two parts: one which you had already fixed, and one which was roundly overturned in DRV. If you want to talk "out of process" going from a closing admin to a re-nominator calls into question whether your original close was made with appropriate detachment. No, scratch that, it again questions that detachment--since the DRV questioned it and found your rationale wanting.

Please, let it be. Admit that your interpretation of NFCC #8 differs from the community's, and either accept that the community has chosen to bear more risk of possible infringement than you are personally comfortable with, or perhaps embark on a campaign to persuade and educate them about why your vision is superior. But don't enter WP:DEADHORSE territory over the same image where your views have been rebuked. DRV has a habit of responding louder the second time it's asked the same question. I could be entirely misreading the situation, and find myself overturned... but I don't think so.

It's your right to start a second DRV if you want to, but I strongly advise against it, because I think it will prompt people to further question your fitness to act impartially in NFCC issues. Jclemens (talk) 08:26, 5 May 2012 (UTC)