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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Khoikhoi (talk | contribs) at 01:27, 24 May 2006 (ah). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

I think everyone should note that Turkey doesn't deny people died. They deny that it was genocide (the elimination of a ethnic, religious, racial etc group with intent), but more like war casualties. --Telex 15:19, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

That's right. it is the same thing that Turkey's leadership is saying 'bout the Armenian Genocide. --Hectorian 01:26, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

• The events herein referred to as Pontian Greek Genocide took place during the expansionist and opportunist Greek assult on the Turkish homeland in the aftermath of the World War I. The Ottoman Empire had disintegrated, the Ottoman capital Constantinople had been seized by the Allies. The fragmented and indigenious Turkish population of Anatolia mounted a defense against the invading Greek army, which eventually led to the formation of the Republic of Turkey. Basically in 1919, there was no Turkish or Ottoman state in control of Anatolia or Pontus. This article claims that an ethnic group (Turkish) without a state, defending itself against a well-organized and well-armed intruder from another country (Greek Army), committed a genocide. No country other than Greece has ever taken this highly dubious theory seriously. The numbers of Pontic Greeks who died during that period is almost impossible to establish. The Turkish losses during the same period in the same geographic area far exceed any probable Greek losses in that region. The Pontic Greeks belonged to the same ethnic group as the invading army of Greece, thus they were automatically at war with the Turkish people. This was a war and the belligerent party was the Greeks. Pontic Greeks have suffered as a result of the miscalculated, poorly fought and unjustified assault by their fellow Greeks. Same thing happened to the Smyrnian Greeks. Turkish people exercised their right to self-defense. That's what the World community has accepted as the truth regarding the Pontian Greeks. Despite the repeated attempts by certain Greeks to establish the so-called Pontian Greek Genocide as fact, so far no World body or no state other than Greece has ever recognized Pontian Greek Genocide. --- Vikiyazar 14:24, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

• Well, we know that the states of New Jersey and South Carolina (at least) have recognized it. Be that as it may though, what exactly are you proposing? While I agree with some of your points, as far as I know, the Greek army progressed beyond the Smyrna zone for the purposes of self defence - apparently, the Turks were not happy with certain aspects of the Treaty of Sèvres and were trying to expel the Greeks. --Telex 14:44, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

• It is true that Smyrna was a city with Greek plurality but it was essentially a Greek island in a Turkish sea. The same can be said of Pontus. Neither locations were contiguous with Greece. It was totally unsustainable in the long term to annex them to Greece. (Look how Armenia and Azerbaijan are still in a state of war over Nagorno-Karabagh.) Similarly, Salonica was mostly Jewish and Turkish. Greeks were in the minority in Salonica. Yet, it was completely Hellenized in the 20th century. I think the evacuation of Greeks from Smyrna and Pontus, although it was deplorable from a human rights point of view, has been beneficial for the preservation of peace between Greece and Turkey. The same thing can be said for Turks who were forced to move to Turkey from Greek lands. I believe we should all move on with respect to the atrocities of the past. Surely, Turks did some terrible things to Greeks in the past. However, Turks also suffered during the Greek Independence War, the Balkan Wars and the Greek Invasion of Anatolia. Labeling any of these atrocities as genocide is inflammatory. The label is not technically true. It causes both sides to compete with each other to prove which side suffered most.

• As far as the U.S. state recognition of the Pontian genocide: Ah! you know those politicians. They will recognize anything if they could get a few more votes. The U.S. states have no authority and responsibility to conduct foreign policy. That responsibility rests solely with the Federal Government. State politicians are fully aware that their foreign policy decisions carry no weight, that's way they use those proclamations and recognitions as symbolic gestures to gain political support. Those are meaningless acts of legislative manuvering. Any state with an organized and numerous ethnic lobby can have state legistlators pass such proclamations. Especially if it doesn't cost the taxpayers any money!!! ---Vikiyazar 18:24, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Contradiction

The "Arguments against" section of the article says:

A letter was submitted to The United Nations Commission on Human Rights by the "International League for the Rights and Liberation of Peoples" to request such recognition in 1998 but so far it has not been granted.

However, the "Official recognition" section says:

The United Nations Commission on Human Rights has recognized this genocide as such in 1998.

Which one is true? Here is the PDF. To me it doesn't look like a letter, but an offical UN document. Correct me if I'm wrong. —Khoikhoi

I think this is what you're looking for. --Telex 01:07, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

The link you gave me doesn't work. :( —Khoikhoi 01:09, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Are you sure - it works for me :-/ --Telex 01:12, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Nope, it just says this:

There is an end-user problem. If you have reached this site from a web link,
- Through your internet options, adjust your privacy settings to allow cookies or
- Check your security settings and make sure this site has not been blocked or
- You are probably using a very slow link that may not work well with this application.
Otherwise you have reached this site through unauthorized means.

—Khoikhoi 01:21, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Well just go to and serch for pontian genocide. The above link works for me though. --Telex 01:22, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Ah, I got it to work. :) It's the exact same PDF as the one I linked in the References section. Anyways, what do you think about my initial comment? —Khoikhoi 01:27, 24 May 2006 (UTC)