Misplaced Pages

Talk:Men's movement

Article snapshot taken from Wikipedia with creative commons attribution-sharealike license. Give it a read and then ask your questions in the chat. We can research this topic together.

This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Sonicyouth86 (talk | contribs) at 20:46, 19 May 2013 (→Use of Weasel Words.: citing wp:weasel doesn't male any sense in this case). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Revision as of 20:46, 19 May 2013 by Sonicyouth86 (talk | contribs) (→Use of Weasel Words.: citing wp:weasel doesn't male any sense in this case)(diff) ← Previous revision | Latest revision (diff) | Newer revision → (diff)
This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Men's movement article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.
Article policies
Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL
Archives: Index, 1Auto-archiving period: 12 months 
WikiProject iconGender studies Start‑class
WikiProject iconThis article is part of WikiProject Gender studies. This WikiProject aims to improve the quality of articles dealing with gender studies and to remove systematic gender bias from Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate in the project, you can choose to edit this article, or visit the project page for more information.Gender studiesWikipedia:WikiProject Gender studiesTemplate:WikiProject Gender studiesGender studies
StartThis article has been rated as Start-class on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale.
???This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.
To-do list:

 Here are some tasks awaiting attention:
WikiProject iconSociology: Social Movements Unassessed
WikiProject iconThis article is within the scope of WikiProject Sociology, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of sociology on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.SociologyWikipedia:WikiProject SociologyTemplate:WikiProject Sociologysociology
???This article has not yet received a rating on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale.
???This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.
Taskforce icon
This article is supported by the social movements task force.

Archiving icon
Archives

Index 1


This page has archives. Sections older than 365 days may be automatically archived by Lowercase sigmabot III when more than 2 sections are present.

"Men's liberation" section POV issue

The Men's movement#Men's liberation section is written very negatively and with an obvious gender feminism slant. It's clear that no one sympathetic to men's liberation has had any input there. This section has serious WP:NPOV problems as a result. I actually agree with what it says, but it's blatantly unencyclopedic to write something this totally oppositional here. (There are plenty of politicians I think are moronic, dangerous jackasses, but I'm not allowed to push that point of view in articles about them here, by way of comparison.) — SMcCandlish   Talk⇒ ɖ∘¿¤þ   Contrib. 09:47, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

Advocacy relating to child support

Under Men's_movement#Advocacy (distinguished the subsection) I am wondering if this list is extensive enough. For example, I see a commonly written about concern with men's inability to abandon a pregnancy, something which females have agency to do due to exclusive rights to abortion, adoption and abandonment choices. Ideas like both parents (and not just women via consenting to keep pregnancy) having to opt-in to have to support. Shouldn't advocacy regarding child support and procreation consent fairness also be included? Ranze (talk) 17:46, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

Rewrite

The "Men's and fathers' rights movements" section has been tagged as unsourced since July 2010. I removed the unsourced claims and replaced them with content from the MRM and FRM articles. Feel free to expand the section with more references. --Sonicyouth86 (talk) 14:41, 28 March 2013 (UTC)

SPLC commentary

The Southern Poverty Law Center's, (SPLC), Intelligence Reports have been declared a reliable sources for Misplaced Pages, so I have been repeated informed. These Intelligence reports have been used by law enforcement and cited by academics. Their commentary on the Men Movement includes,

  • The men’s movement also includes mail-order-bride shoppers, unregenerate batterers, and wannabe pickup artists who are eager to learn the secrets of “game”—the psychological tricks that supposedly make it easy to seduce women.
  • The common denominator is their resentment of feminism and of females in general.
  • Some take an inordinate interest in extremely young women, or fetishize what they see as the ultra-feminine (read: docile) characteristics of South American and Asian women.

It is not for us to second guess sources but merely record what they say. Clearly this material is significant investigative work and should be included in the page.

CSDarrow (talk) 02:43, 23 April 2013 (UTC)

Use of Weasel Words.

RE: "Sociologists Michael Messner and Michael Flood have argued that the term "movement" is problematic..."

The use of the unqualified term 'sociologist' infers an arms length and expert commentary. Michael Messner and Michael Flood are undeniably from a particular school of thought, in particular they are pro-feminists. Without further qualification the term 'sociologist' becomes a Weasel word. To quote WP:WEASEL, " may disguise a biased view.". Messner, Flood and Kimmel are pro-feminists and where appropriate this should be mentioned. CSDarrow (talk) 17:23, 19 May 2013 (UTC)

Are you somehow suggesting that to be "pro-feminist" is to have a prejudice against MRM? Gee. it certainly can be shown that the other way seems to be accurate enough, but I'm not sure that the above statement is true. Perhaps you could start a list of academics who have no personal views about anything at all and then we could draw all our references from that list? Carptrash (talk) 19:09, 19 May 2013 (UTC)
It must be a joke to suggest that "sociologists" is a weasel word but "profeminist sociologists" isn't. Please do not quote out of context: Misplaced Pages:Manual_of_Style/Words_to_watch#Unsupported_attributions says that "They may disguise a biased view". Surely you see that the statements are attributed to Messner and Kimmel and that citing Misplaced Pages:WEASEL#Unsupported_attributions as a reason for your edits doesn't make any sense. --Sonicyouth86 (talk) 20:46, 19 May 2013 (UTC)
Categories: