Misplaced Pages

This is an old revision of this page, as edited by I invented "it's not you, it's me" (talk | contribs) at 04:37, 8 March 2015 (→Your talk page - semi-protection). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Talk Israel thread: This article details Jewish casualties but not Arab casualties, is it giving a NPOV?

You started the above named RfC thread recently. I have recently added a subheading restating the initial question as I considered that the discussion was veering off topic. I know that you also added other perspectives / rephrasings in regard to this question which I may have reverted and thought you should be aware that I have only gone as far as to refer back to the original question.

I would also be interested in hearing of specific reverts of information that I think that I would regard to be Censored.

GregKaye 12:45, 18 January 2015 (UTC)

Thank you for your work on editing the Israel article. I do not think the article has a NPOV, and I think it is anti-Arab. The article details many events with fewer than 50 Jewish deaths, such as the “On 11 March 1978, a PLO guerilla raid from Lebanon led to the Coastal Road Massacre, in which 38 Israeli civilians were killed and 71 injured” statement in the article. When I tried to add references to events with greater than 50 non-Jewish deaths, such as the Deir Yassin massacre and King David Hotel bombing, they where immediately reverted, and there is still no mention of these events in the article. When I tried to add casualty numbers to the one sentence referencing the 1936–39 Arab revolt in Palestine, this change was also reverted. I believe all these events are at least as relevant to Israel's history as the Coastal Road Massacre, and should be included in a NPOV article. I believe they we deleted because most of the editors want an article that reflects their anti-Arab bias, and not a NPOV article. I am not Arab or Jewish, I have no bias feelings either way on the subject, and I am only interested in seeing a NPOV article. Gouncbeatduke (talk)

Semi-protection

I've semi'd the page due to harassment. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 08:41, 17 February 2015 (UTC)

• On a side note, I'd like to ask that whomever is posting the death threats and so on stop. Seriously, this is not the way to go about accomplishing things and it has been reported. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 08:49, 17 February 2015 (UTC)

I missed it. Is there any way I can see how the "death threats" where worded? It looks like your superduper administrator reverts make it impossible to read. Gouncbeatduke (talk) 18:32, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

Never mind, I got them via email. Gouncbeatduke (talk) 15:18, 20 February 2015 (UTC)

A guard kitten for you!

Couldn't help but to see that thread on ANI and thought your talk page could use some cheer and fuzzy protection in light of it. Keep up the good work and don't let childish behaviour deter you!

Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie | 28 Shevat 5775 16:30, 17 February 2015 (UTC)

Thank you for my furocious guard kitten, I am sure he will keep my family safe from those making death threats. Gouncbeatduke (talk) 15:19, 20 February 2015 (UTC)

Surely you mean his furry furocious fury shall keep the baddies at bay! No one ever gives me death threats. I'm jealous.... Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie | 3 Adar 5775 16:33, 22 February 2015 (UTC)

Re: user page talks

Gouncbeatduke, you do have the right to ask someone to look into actions taken on your user page. However I don't think that directly asking (User name removed) in this manner is going to accomplish anything. I don't know if he's the person who is doing this and I have no opinion on that. However at the same time you have to consider this: what if he isn't? It's entirely possible that it could be someone else that is doing this and that (User name removed) is entirely unrelated to this. Having differences or issues with one another in other places on Misplaced Pages does not automatically mean that (User name removed) is the one harassing you and posting like this can in itself be seen as a form of harassment. Really, I don't think that there was any good way to go about asking someone directly about something like this, especially since even if you're correct (and again, I'm not saying that you are) it's extremely unlikely that someone will outright state that they made sockpuppets to make death threats against you since not only would that lead to a permablock and sanctions, but it could also potentially lead to legal actions off Misplaced Pages depending on where one or both parties live. Gouncbeatduke, I've reported the entire sockpuppet death threats to the Wikimedia legal team, who is looking into everything. If you want to get in touch with them then you can through this e-mail address: emergencywikimedia.org. I know that you must be genuinely rattled and even scared by the threats on your talk page. I've had people make threats against me in the past as well, but this just isn't the best way to go about this. I've removed the thread since there's no positive way that could end and I don't think you'd be able to get the answer you need. I've tagged (User name removed) in this but I'd like to ask that he not reply to this and I'd like to suggest that if possible, that the two of you avoid one another for a little while and if you two do need to revert one another's edits, that you go through another user familiar with the article/topic or through third opinion or dispute resolution. Hopefully things will cool down but right now I just don't think it's a good idea for the two of you to interact with each other. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 05:27, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

• Also, since he will obviously read this, I'd like to ask that neither of you use your own talk pages to make indirect comments to one another. I'd like to avoid this going to ANI, if possible. Like I said above, this is being investigated but if you want to directly talk to Wikimedia's legal department then you can through the address above. Now as far as the questions about the threats made on your page, there's no real way that I could let you see them on your talk page without undoing the deletions, although Wikimedia should be able to provide you with this since they have far more permissions/control on Misplaced Pages than an average admin does. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 05:34, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

Dear Tokyogirl79, As the death threat editor appears to have used some software to mask his real IP address, I imagine Misplaced Pages’s legal team will recommend allowing any likely socks to continue, despite the death threats. I think you are correct that I made a mistake focusing on a suspect with a similar pattern of behavior, as it will be impossible to prove who was behind this. I expect the only way to deter whoever made the death threats will be if I continue to remove pro-Jewish/anti-Arab non-NPOV edits from Misplaced Pages articles, and he sees that his intimidation tactics do not work. Gouncbeatduke (talk) 15:42, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

• Comment: If I may comment on something here, even though I'm not involved in this specific incident.... Even though there is no excuse whatsoever for threatening another editor with bodily harm (childishly or seriously), I do think that using terminology such as "Pro-Jewish" in this way is not what I, at the very least, would consider good practice as it casts us like some sort of political faction or idea whereas we are a collection ethno-religious groups. I speak as a Jewish Pro-Palestinian Zionist who wears a Jordanian shemagh daily (and who keeps all his views out of his actual editting). It might be better to refer to the actions of the other user as POV-pushing and anti-Arab (which clearly means hatred of Arabs, something I personally find revolting). Saying "Pro-Jewish/anti-Arab" is something I find really irksome and I'm not easily irked by anything (though more sensitive Jews might find it a bit offensive). For one, it makes it sound like Jews and Arabs are polar opposites, which we are not, and for another, as I said, it makes us sound like a bit of an agenda (which we might be for many politicians, but we're still people) or at least have an agenda (which no one told me about if we do). And yes, I would say the same thing about pro-Arab, pro-Kurdish, pro-Japanese, etc. I hope you'll take these concerns into consideration. Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie | 30 Shevat 5775 18:33, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

Thank you for pointing that out. I plan to use the term "anti-Arab non-NPOV" in the future. Gouncbeatduke (talk) 19:03, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

I forgot to add that I know you didn't mean it that way. Apologies if I came across as being harsh at all as it was not my intention, more some unsolicited advice which I hope is helpful. Also, the person whoever the person is that is making those threats seriously needs to reexamine their life, and if they are in fact Jewish, needs to stop embarrassing the rest of us (!יעלה, היה יהודי/ת באמת). Anyway, that's my two ago rot and I'll let you get this talk back on track. Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie | 30 Shevat 5775 22:29, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

I think you have NO reason to be embarrassed, and, even if it were true (and I am not saying it is) the bad behavior of one individual or a minority of individuals should never be considered a comment on an ethnic group or a religion (but I also admit to having feelings of embarrassment about jerks of my own ethnic and religious background). Gouncbeatduke (talk) 16:50, 22 February 2015 (UTC)

It's kind of an old Yiddish idea I'm getting at there. Back when Jews were all shtetly and timid, there was this idea of not acting shameful in front of non-Jews. (Pardon any mistakes as I don't actually known Yiddish) שאנדא פור די גויים "Shanda für die Goyim" (shame/disgrace in front of the goyim). The expression still survives, though not the attitude (at least not much). Judging by your potential stalker's long term abuse page, does seem like a rather unpleasant fellow. Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie | 4 Adar 5775 20:51, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

He does sound unpleasant. I'm glad it turned out not to be the editor I asked about it. I still don't understand why that editor wouldn't give me a straight answer when I asked, but I suppose there are all sorts of cultural differences I don't understand. Gouncbeatduke (talk) 13:32, 24 February 2015 (UTC)

He was kind enough to create an account dubbing me "one of them self hatin' Jews" and used what Coffee could only describe as colourful language. Eh, cultural differences are always tricky. I'll never understand Californians, but Arabs, Israelis, Italians, etc. are easy by comparison. Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie | 9 Adar 5775 23:53, 28 February 2015 (UTC)

Your talk page - semi-protection

Hi Grouncbeatduke, I've semi-protected this page for three days because of renewed activity from the same individual. Sorry about the inconvenience.--Bbb23 (talk) 01:27, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

Don't feel bad, I got this wee bit of Wikilove soon after: "Disgusting self-hater, you filthy traitorous vermin. Arab-loving freak" - I definitely love Arabs, but idk being about filthy and disgusting, self-hating or traitorous. I am rather loyal and arrogant after all and I do shower daily... maybe it's because I only shampoo every other day? I don't want my hair to dry out though... Though I also spend two months of the year playing in the dirt. You think that's it? Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie | 17 Adar 5775 01:36, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

All archeologists are dirty. --Bbb23 (talk) 02:41, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

Oh, mate, you have no idea.... Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie | 17 Adar 5775 02:48, 8 March 2015 (UTC)

1RR violation

Your edit on Elder of Ziyon is not just blatant vandalism, but also a violation of 1RR. Best revert it NOW, or I will report you. I invented "it's not you, it's me" (talk) 04:37, 8 March 2015 (UTC)