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Thanks

Hi DrChrissy, just wanted to say thanks for your participation at the ref desks! A quick glance here shows you are also very active at improving WP mainspace, so thanks for that too. I keep meaning to do more for articles, but I usually only have the attention span to make minor grammar edits, and deal with higher level stuff as one-offs at the ref desk :) SemanticMantis (talk) 00:19, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Hi. Thanks very much for the positive message. Your stuff at the ref desk is always very informative and well written - keep up the good work! I intend to start a shake up of the Cursorial article tomorrow - I might see you there. All the best. DrChrissy 00:26, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

Yes, thanks for your edits on the cursorial thread at the ref desk. μηδείς (talk) 01:46, 18 November 2015 (UTC)

ArbCom elections are now open!

Hi,
You appear to be eligible to vote in the current Arbitration Committee election. The Arbitration Committee is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Misplaced Pages arbitration process. It has the authority to enact binding solutions for disputes between editors, primarily related to serious behavioural issues that the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the ability to impose site bans, topic bans, editing restrictions, and other measures needed to maintain our editing environment. The arbitration policy describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail. If you wish to participate, you are welcome to review the candidates' statements and submit your choices on the voting page. For the Election committee, MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 14:30, 24 November 2015 (UTC)

No turkey celebration in your neck of the woods?

Here in the US we welcome every opportunity for a holiday!! If it were left up to our school children, they would transpose the number of school days with the number of holidays. DrChrissy, I sympathize with what you're going through with the waves battering against your shoreline. It's erosive, even against solid rock. Sometimes the behavior I've witnessed at the drama boards reminds me a little of the book, "Cannibalism, Ecology and Evolution Among Diverse Taxa" published by the Oxford University Press. Perhaps it has something to do with the book's description per the NYT "that when animals eat their own species they are not just looking for another meal but also seeking to destroy competitors", . Granted, it's a rather extreme hyperbole, so I will AGF by saying that I can't imagine any editor who doesn't want to edit unencumbered or be shackled by mass confusion. I've also heard that when a storm moves inland, it dissipates so the best thing to do is just batten down the hatches and ride it out. Can you believe the holidays are upon us? Wow. Atsme 18:25, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

DrChrissy, I just want to add that I can very much empathize with how stressful that AN discussion must be for you, and I want to offer you my sincere hopes that you can be of good cheer nonetheless. --Tryptofish (talk) 18:53, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Thanks Both. Yes, the ArbCom situation is EXTREMELY stressful - not least because it has been totally unexpected (perhaps naively) on my part. I'm currently being very guarded about my comments about the process because I really fear they may draw unintended attention to others who do not deserve this and my comments may also cause a backlash against me. I think the worst part is the absolute silence and the apparent lack of reading of our comments and questions. It really is...well...(please insert your own words!) But I will post something about my take on the process and findings when the dust has settled. As for Turkeys in my neck of the woods - I live in a rural area (Somerset) where shooting of game birds is a popular pastime for some. I don't eat turkeys (after having worked with them under modern production husbandry systems), so I might try pheasant this Christmas. Hope you have enjoyed your Thanksgiving celebrations. By the way - have you seen that Petrarchan appears to have retired? Very worrying.DrChrissy 19:12, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

I've seen that, but I had best not comment. I also saw that Guy apologized to SageRad, which is something happier. Let me presume to say some things about the ArbCom case. The way it looks for you, it will likely have two effects. One is that you will not be able to edit about GMO plants or agricultural chemicals, two subject where I suspect you really do not have many interests. (I don't know what will happen at AN, but my gut feeling is that that topic ban will be lifted.) The other is that, in the unlikely event that Jytdog comes back, he will be forced to leave you alone. Interestingly, he will be forbidden to edit about GMO animals such as that salmon, whereas you will be free to edit there, and he won't be able to say anything about your editing there. If you look at it that way, then maybe it's not that bad, although I don't mean by that to minimize the stress of it in any way. And I think that I have already made it abundantly clear that I am less than impressed by the way those in charge have handled the GMO case. As for my Thanksgiving, "I can't believe I ate the whole thing" (a catch-phrase from a long-ago US TV ad for an antacid). Truly, I hope that you are able to remain cheerful and that the near future will allow you to put all the aggravation behind you. Best, --Tryptofish (talk) 19:42, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

I have just realised I misread your first posting. I thought you were talking about the ArbCom process, but you are talking about the AN process. Yes, I am also extremely frustrated about what is going on at AN. One thing I have found out about myself, and this has been with your help, is that when I am being goaded, I struggle to understand where the line is between defending myself and feeding the trolls. It is obvious that I am being goaded over there, but I have always had a strong sense of fairness, and what goes on over there is absolutely not fair. I have seriously considered withdrawing my appeal and walking away from wikipedia, but I will not do that. There is so much support for me over there that I would be letting down those people by withdrawing. I may, however, take a break from editing for a while. I just wish an Admin would step in and close it. The discussion is now not doing anybody any good - it is simply becoming another example of a rather dysfunctional process.DrChrissy 20:10, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

I've had my own share of me replying many times during dispute resolution and later wishing that I had responded fewer times. It's a no-win situation, and a frustrating one. I, too, have been musing out loud on my user talk page about walking away, but I've been coming to the conclusion that what people here say about me reveals more about them than about me. --Tryptofish (talk) 20:28, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Yes I saw your comments and I followed what went on leading to those with great sympathy for you. I would not have blamed you for walking away and I am very glad you did not. I'm rather lacking in motivation at the moment (for some reason!) but maybe we (and others of course) should try and turn this into a positive and ensure that these processes are looked at. One idea I had was to develop an ethics committee of paid members who are not associated with WP in any other way to look at these dispute processes. Just an idea.DrChrissy 20:36, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for the kind words. (And User:Tryptofish/ACE2015.) --Tryptofish (talk) 21:17, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

I agree many threads on Misplaced Pages are frustrating and unproductive because they are controlled by editors who either do not read and consider arguments opposed to their own position, or who repeatedly project shadow aspects of their own behaviour onto other editors. Responding in a thoughtful manner is a complete waste of time. And because there's no impartial centralised decision body on Misplaced Pages, there is nothing that can be done about it. There's ArbCom of course, a rather politicized body that often manages to make things worse. I like your idea of an independent paid ethics board DrChrissy, though there remains the issue of how the members of that board would be selected and held to account. --Epipelagic (talk) 21:41, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

And, in what is probably the reason it will not happen, there also remains the issue of getting the community to buy into the idea. Any RfC about adopting it would look like the worst ANI thread imaginable. --Tryptofish (talk) 21:49, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Well yes, but you are talking about trying to change the system from within the system itself. That won't happen. But other external interests have a stake in open source information. Misplaced Pages is currently the world's premier repository of open source information. This information does not belong to Jimbo Wales and the maintenance workers. It was put there, for free, by the content builders. The global push for open source information is not going away, and it is a push that is bigger than Misplaced Pages. I would think many professional bodies will be looking for better treatment than Misplaced Pages currently offers their members when they try to contribute definitive open source information. If the Misplaced Pages administration in unable to to develop some sensitivity and respect towards content development then Misplaced Pages will lose status. If the janitors remain in control Misplaced Pages is going to be increasingly bypassed as a serious project. --Epipelagic (talk) 22:38, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Hmmmm...I think DrChrissy's proposal has merit and might just fit the project if presented properly to the Foundation via the IdeaLab, . What could it hurt if he/we at least presented his idea for consideration? Atsme 22:16, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Banners

DrChrissy, you found a page that I completely forgot about - User talk:Atsme/Banners. In fact, I created User:Atsme/Banners because I couldn't find the other one! 👀 Now I know where it is and will figure out some way to merge the two. Thank you! Atsme 16:58, 30 November 2015 (UTC)

I think I found it only by following your links, so you might have a link there that you don't want/did not realise. I particularly liked the "blocks" one!DrChrissy 17:11, 30 November 2015 (UTC)

A little nonsequitur on Domesticated turkey...

Hi DrChrissy, I just wanted you to know that I'm not trying to actually remove that passage on the FAWC data. I just can't figure out what it's trying to say. As it stands, it's looks nonsequitur, is unclear, and looks like original analysis. I left (will leave) some details of what I mean on the talk page. DrAlso (talk) 20:58, 30 November 2015 (UTC)

Hi DrChrissy, On the DT talk page I added a detailed analysis of the logic errors, innuendo, etc. in the first paragraph of the "Welfare Concerns" section. Would you like a crack at addressing it? DrAlso (talk) 08:36, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

Has been addressed. By the way, it is generally considered very bad manners to ban someone from your talk page and then post to their talk page! Your message above is about article content and should have been posted to the article Talk page, not here.DrChrissy 19:02, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

Anecdotal gar reports

See the link when you get a chance. It's one of the reasons I was reluctant in using the photo. I'll do some further checking on Commons. Thanks in advance... Atsme 20:23, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

I had a look yesterday and realised they were the same photos! The link has left me a little confused - are the images photoshopped?DrChrissy 17:12, 7 December 2015 (UTC)

They're probably legitimate snapshots but the concern is whether or not the ones uploaded to Commons were properly licensed by the actual copyright holder, or if they are unauthorized copies that were farmed off the internet. The images are currently on a sort of watchlist at Commons. Atsme 20:55, 7 December 2015 (UTC)

It's that time of year....

	Time To Spread Some Happy Holiday Cheer!!
	I decorated a special kind of Christmas tree in the spirit of the season. What's especially nice about the digitized version is that it doesn't need water, and it won't catch fire.
	Wishing you a joyous holiday season... ...and a prosperous New Year!! 🍸🎁 🎉
	--Atsme 22:22, 10 December 2015 (UTC)	Pure pun-ishment.

Genetically modified organisms case closed

This arbitration case has been closed and the final decision is available at the link above. The following remedies have been enacted:

1) Standard discretionary sanctions are authorised for all pages relating to genetically modified organisms, agricultural biotechnology, and agricultural chemicals, broadly construed.

2) Editors are prohibited from making more than one revert per page per day on any page relating to genetically modified organisms, agricultural biotechnology, and agricultural chemicals, broadly construed and subject to the usual exemptions.

3) Jytdog and DrChrissy are placed indefinitely under a two-way interaction ban.

7) DrChrissy is indefinitely topic-banned from all pages relating to genetically modified plants and agricultural chemicals, broadly interpreted; appeals of this ban may be requested no earlier than twelve months since the date the case closed.

8) Jytdog is indefinitely topic-banned from all pages relating to genetically modified organisms and agricultural chemicals, broadly interpreted; appeals of this ban may be requested no earlier than twelve months since the date the case closed.

9) Jytdog is admonished for their poor civility in relation to the locus of this case.

11) SageRad is indefinitely topic-banned from all pages relating to genetically modified organisms and agricultural chemicals, broadly construed; appeals of this ban may be requested no earlier than twelve months since the date the case closed.

12) Wuerzele is indefinitely topic-banned from all pages relating to genetically modified organisms and agricultural chemicals, broadly construed; appeals of this ban may be requested no earlier than twelve months since the date the case closed.

For the Arbitration Committee, Miniapolis 20:25, 12 December 2015 (UTC)

Discuss this at: Misplaced Pages talk:Arbitration Committee/Noticeboard#Genetically modified organisms case closed

I have commented on SageRad's Talk page, and feel the same way towards you. My best wishes, and please don't leave Misplaced Pages. We need you more than ever. Jusdafax 05:34, 13 December 2015 (UTC)

Hey

Sorry to be so blunt - but Dennis made it clear that he wanted a break from all of this. Maybe look somewhere else? — Ched :  ?  01:14, 14 December 2015 (UTC)

You deleted a polite posting of mine to another user's Talk Page! This is absolutely outrageous! How dare you! And I have just seen you are an Admin...words fail me! DrChrissy 01:31, 14 December 2015 (UTC)

...and you have just edited my Talk page again without my permission...DrChrissy 14:41, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

I reverted my own comments which were ignored not responded to. I believe that is within policy. — Ched :  ?  14:50, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

@Ched: May I hold out an olive branch to you. Looking at your Talk page, you seem to be a very genuine person, and I accept that you made the deletions to protect another editor. I still think that it is wrong to simply delete another editor's comments on a third party's Talk page, but I very likely over-reacted to your doing that. Regarding my not replying to your postings here, I was following advice (given rather ironically by Trypto) to not reply immediately to posts and to count to 10 before replying. I was still counting - I am a slow counter. So, I am hoping we can both put this episode behind us and move forward to both better the project.DrChrissy 20:28, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

Let me just say that I've known Ched since very close to when I first started editing, and he's a fine guy and a nice person. --Tryptofish (talk) 20:34, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

I was guessing that when you recently posted on your own Talk page. It was that posting which motivated me to calm down and offer the olive branch. I hope he accepts.DrChrissy 20:48, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

All good; I accept - and thank you. I really was sorry to be a source of stress during difficult times, and I honestly did not mean to upset you. I thought my repeated apology notes to your page might look like badgering to you, so I thought I'd remove them. Anyway - I do wish you the best. (and ty Trypto for the kind words.) — Ched :  ?  20:56, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

Thank you so much for accepting. All is now well. And I extend our mutual thanks to our Poisson of Rocks - he deserves his tubifex worms today! DrChrissy 21:03, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

(edit conflict) If memory serves, Ched and I first crossed paths at an RfC at Talk:Urination, so DrChrissy, draw whatever conclusions you will. --Tryptofish (talk) 21:06, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

Yes, I keep a jar of freeze-dried tubifex worms for the fishes in my freshwater aquarium. I reconstitute them in a watery garlic extract, and they definitely like them. Saltwater fish, however, not so much. And me, well.... --Tryptofish (talk) 21:09, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

Careful

I just went through all of JzG's edits at the Seralini affair page, and there actually is no violation of 1RR, although it came close. Please don't comment on it any further, because that page is part of your topic ban, and any further comment about it is going to get you blocked. --Tryptofish (talk) 18:34, 14 December 2015 (UTC)

Tryptofish is right; any further "general" discussions about things that happen on pages you're topic banned from discussing will start resulting in blocks. I've closed the WP:AN thread. The same is going to happen if you speak with other editors about these pages in code (i.e. "that editor on that page" is not going to be an adequate defense). There are lots of people who are not topic banned who can address issues on these pages if they come up. I really suggest you remove these pages from your watchlist completely, as there is no benefit to you from seeing what happens on them. --Floquenbeam (talk) 19:39, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

Thank you for the explanation. I really thought I was OK to discuss other editor's (potential) breaches of 1RR so long as I did not mention the page or topic I am banned from. It seemed to me to be a question related to another editor's behaviour, unrelated to the protection of that page. It appears I am wrong. Thank you.DrChrissy 19:46, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

Floq is exactly right. I think you get it now, but out of friendly concern, I really want to make absolutely certain that you are clear about it. It's not OK to get involved with conduct disputes within the areas of your topic bans and your interaction ban. Even if there is bad behavior in the ban areas, you cannot utter a word about it, even if you are using crafty language, and even if it is only in user talk space. It applies both to content and to conduct discussions. OK? --Tryptofish (talk) 19:58, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

Yup, I understand that now. I honestly did not appreciate that nuance of a topic ban, but I do now. Thanks as usual for the cool-headed mentoring.DrChrissy 20:04, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

My pleasure, and I really hope that we both can soon get back to peaceful and worry-free editing. Cheers! --Tryptofish (talk) 20:18, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

You might want to strike or remove that comment

Its likely that the comment on JzG's section violates the GMO topic ban you are under. You might want to strike/remove it. AlbinoFerret 18:42, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

That's correct. An Arb just said so, very explicitly. --Tryptofish (talk) 18:49, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Done. Better to play safe. I have not seen the Arb's comment yet. DrChrissy 18:51, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Good, I'm glad, that was a close one. It's at the noticeboard talk page, where the Arb responded to Sage below your question. --Tryptofish (talk) 18:54, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

As a rule I would avoid commenting on noticeboards on the topic if I were in your shoes. There is an exemption in your case as pertains to animals. But odds are that any noticeboard section will involve more than that. AlbinoFerret 18:57, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Thanks both of you.DrChrissy 19:02, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

And you definitely want to strike this . That in no way, shape or form falls under the exemptions in BANEX. You're not asking for clarification or appealing the ban in the proper venue. Capeo (talk) 16:28, 18 December 2015 (UTC)

WP:AE notification

I have opened a section on you at WP:AE regarding your recent violation of your topic ban. Please comment there. Only in death does duty end (talk) 16:22, 18 December 2015 (UTC)

DrChrissy, the above AE request has been closed with a warning to you. Your post to User talk:SlimVirgin was not one of the exemptions to your topic ban permitted by WP:BANEX. Thank you, EdJohnston (talk) 15:01, 21 December 2015 (UTC)

Thank you for your handling of this. I note the warning and apologise to the community for breaching my exemptions.DrChrissy 17:27, 21 December 2015 (UTC)

Seasons Greetings

Seasons Greetings!

I've been hearing from the elves that you've been a little worried about how Santa's list is looking for you. They say he's almost done with his second check, and so far it looks like you've hardly been naughty at all! Thanks for the good work you do; you have brought joy into my work here. I wish you and your family Seasons Greetings and a very Happy New Year Gandydancer (talk) 18:31, 23 December 2015 (UTC)

Season's Greetings

	Wishing you a Charlie Brown Charlie Russell Christmas! 🎄
	Best wishes for your Christmas Is all you get from me 'Cause I ain't no Santa Claus Don't own no Christmas tree. But if wishes was health and money I'd fill your buck-skin poke Your doctor would go hungry An' you never would be broke." —C.M. Russell, Christmas greeting 1914. Montanabw

Reference errors on 24 December

Hello, I'm ReferenceBot. I have automatically detected that an edit performed by you may have introduced errors in referencing. It is as follows:

• On the Hare coursing page, your edit caused a broken reference name (help). (Fix | Ask for help)

Please check this page and fix the errors highlighted. If you think this is a false positive, you can report it to my operator. Thanks, ReferenceBot (talk) 00:21, 25 December 2015 (UTC)

ARCA request archived

Just a note to let you know that your recent ARCA request has been archived.
For the Arbitration Committee, Mdann52 (talk) 17:29, 27 December 2015 (UTC)

Request to Jimbo Wales

Jimbo, I have posted below my appeal for a request to ArbCom to amend a decision of theirs. This has now been archived. As I indicated on your talk page, I believe this is a matter of principle in the way that Misplaced Pages operates, rather than just a single decision abut a single editor's behaviour. I have been topic banned from an area in which I have never edited. Despite my asking for evidence of such editing, none has been produced by any user or arbitrator. I feel it is a very dangerous precedent for ArbCom to ban editors from places they have not even edited, let alone disrupted.

Original email to ArbCom

I would like to request an amendment to my recently imposed topic ban. I am requesting the amendment deletes the inclusion of "genetically modified plants and". I am requesting this amendment because there is a total absence of evidence that I have been disruptive in this topic area. I respectfully quote the WP:banning policy as "The purpose of a topic ban is to forbid an editor from making edits related to a certain topic area where their contributions have been disruptive, but to allow them to edit the rest of Misplaced Pages." (my highlighting). Below, I provide evidence that I have not been disruptive in this topic area, in fact, I have not made a single content edit about GM-plants in my history of editing WP.

I have reviewed all the submissions relating to myself presented during the evidence phase of the GMO case. There was not a single diff provided by any party which related to me editing or discussing GM-plants.

I have also reviewed all my edits for the year of 2015. This review showed that I have not made a single edit of article content relating to GM-plants. In the last 12 months, I have edited only two articles about GMOs which contain sections on GM-plants, i.e. Genetically modified food and Genetically modified organism.

I made a handful of edits (6) on the Genetically modified food article (

) but these were all unrelated to GM-plants.

I made 13 edits to Genetically modified organism. The vast majority of these related to animals and were often simple editorial changes such as typos, links, redundant words. I made one edit potentially tangentially related to GM-plants - I reformatted a reference title to be lowercase rather than uppercase. I reverted only a single edit here and although my revert was itself reverted, I did not engage in any behaviour that might be considered disruptive.

Prior to the GMO case, I was heavily involved in editing Glyphosate and I accept the ArbCom's decision to topic ban me from the area of agricultural chemicals as a remedy. However, I think there has been an inadvertent "topic-creep" which has led to the unnecessary inclusion of GM-plants in my ban. I have not been disruptive in the slightest in the topic area of GM-plants. My overall concern here is that some editors believe that because my topic ban includes plants, general GMO articles such as Genetically modified organism are included in my ban. I would be very grateful for a clarification by ArbCom that if this amendment is approved, my topic ban does not include these general GMO articles.

I respectfully await your decision on my request for an amendment.

All other editors please note, this thread is only for Jimmy Wales to comment - all other postings are highly likely to be deleted without comment by myself.

DrChrissy 18:17, 27 December 2015 (UTC)

Just FYI, I do not agree with the decision either but editing the article for Genetically modified fish after the decision was made restricting you from the topic probably isn't going to help your cause. Also, going to Jimbo won't help either because he has never and will never override an Arbcom sanction. As much as I too wish he would on occasion do so, its not going to happen and his name really should be removed from the policy saying he has the authority to do it. Arbcom can pretty much do anything they want and there is no appealing it, changing it or revoking it without a significant amount of work, time and luck. Good luck all the same. Maj Turmoil (talk) 20:32, 28 December 2015 (UTC)

Actually, Maj, the topic ban was intentionally crafted so that writing about GM animals is OK, so there is nothing wrong with DrC working on that page. --Tryptofish (talk) 20:50, 28 December 2015 (UTC)

Thanks Trypto - I was just writing a reply saying the same. I think Maj has perhaps understandably fallen into the trap of reading and believing the lies my detractors are repeatedly posting.DrChrissy 20:55, 28 December 2015 (UTC)

Ah good to know thanks, I apologize. I hadn't read the whole thing through and didn't catch that. I simply assumed organism included animals. Maj Turmoil (talk) 21:01, 28 December 2015 (UTC)

The arbcom's DS and 1RR apply to "organisms". My topic ban applies to "genetically modified plants". Could I suggest in the friendliest of ways that you strike your misunderstanding on both this page and on my Talk page. This shows to the community that you have understood a mistake was made. Best wishes.DrChrissy 21:12, 28 December 2015 (UTC)

Clarificaiton request filed.

Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Clarification_and_Amendment#Clarification_request:_Genetically_modified_organisms_2. Guy (Help!) 00:53, 29 December 2015 (UTC)

Happy New Year, DrChrissy!

DrChrissy,
Have a prosperous, productive and enjoyable New Year, and thanks for your contributions to Misplaced Pages. LesVegas (talk) 15:45, 1 January 2016 (UTC)

Send New Year cheer by adding {{subst:Happy New Year fireworks}} to user talk pages.

FYI

Some very good comments here and here. SageRad (talk) 19:51, 2 January 2016 (UTC)

It's only right...

...to let you know about the comment I left on the talk page of Emotion in animals. Best Regards,   Bfpage |leave a message  01:13, 3 January 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for letting me know.DrChrissy 19:51, 3 January 2016 (UTC)

January 2016

If you believe this block is unjustified, please read the guide to appealing blocks (specifically this section) before appealing. Place the following on your talk page: {{unblock|reason=Please copy my appeal to the ] or ]. Your reason here OR place the reason below this template. ~~~~}}. If you intend to appeal on the arbitration enforcement noticeboard I suggest you use the arbitration enforcement appeals template on your talk page so it can be copied over easily. You may also appeal directly to me (by email), before or instead of appealing on your talk page. Floquenbeam (talk) 20:48, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

Reminder to administrators: In May 2014, ArbCom adopted the following procedure instructing administrators regarding Arbitration Enforcement blocks: "No administrator may modify a sanction placed by another administrator without: (1) the explicit prior affirmative consent of the enforcing administrator; or (2) prior affirmative agreement for the modification at (a) AE or (b) AN or (c) ARCA (see "Important notes" ). Administrators modifying sanctions out of process may at the discretion of the committee be desysopped."

Useful links:

• Applicable arb case: Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Genetically modified organisms#Jytdog & DrChrissy iban
• WP:AE discussion:

--Floquenbeam (talk) 20:51, 5 January 2016 (UTC)

Motion that pertains to you

Hi, this message is inform you that a motion pertaining to you has been proposed at Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Clarification and Amendment. For the Arbitration Committee, Kharkiv07 (T) 03:00, 6 January 2016 (UTC)

Ant self-recognition

Broadening of topic bans

@SageRad: I agree entirely with you regarding the broadening of topic bans. I too have just had my topic ban considerably extended.here This has been without any evidence provided at any stage of the case and its fall-out that my editing was problematic in this broadened area. How can this process of substantially extending topic bans simply ignore the process which which has been set up to be fair and to be seen to be fair (although this is arguable in itself). There are also 2 other aspects to consider. One is the change in Arbcom members during these topic ban broadenings. This is like changing the judges halfway through a case - surely in such a complex case a re-trial would be expected. The second aspect is a psychological one. New members of ArbCom are extremely unlikely in their first dealing to argue or vote against a previous ArbCom finding. Moreover, they would be very keen to prove themselves as being very decisive and keen to comment/vote - this can be seen in some of the comments put next to votes (a practice I believe is totally unnecessary and very often inflammatory.

There is something very, very deeply wrong at ArbCom.DrChrissy 12:39, 6 January 2016 (UTC)

DrChrissy, the whole thing of topic bans bothers me in principle. If an editor shows bad behavior in general, then how about banning the editor altogether? Otherwise let them be. I think that bad behavior needs to be addressed when it first happens and treated as a learning opportunity. Blocks for a few days are great to let an editor cool down and re-focus on how to approach a question better. But to let problems build up over months, and then to ban editors from a topic for a year minimum -- it's essentially a recipe for Inquisitions. It's a recipe for political purging. I've used the phrase McCarthyism several times for very good reason. The whole thing stinks like an ideological purging, and the whole basis is frankly, bullshit. Every editor in the whole topic area of agrochemicals and GMOs has made a few mistakes in judgment. Every editor has contributed good thoughts and edits, as well.

Anyway, on topic, yes of course, to expand the scope of a topic ban after the whole process is clearly wrong. It's no longer "clarification" but rather domain creep. So if i cannot edit about any chemical made by any company that makes even a single thing used in agriculture, then i wouldn't be able to edit about PTFE (teflon) or its related additives, or polystyrene (Styrofoam), or many many other chemicals that are present in the world. How is that ok? It would be a ridiculous limitation. It's not my fault that a single company makes many products. If people want to expand the scope of a topic ban, then they need to go through the same process that led to the original topic ban, with the new topic ban stated. This is not about clarification, but rather about expansion of the "win" by a group of people with a particular point of view. SageRad (talk) 12:47, 6 January 2016 (UTC)

And if the user has the temerity to try and use enforcement - slap them with a one-week block so that everyone is running round scared shitless to actually indicate when other users are actually breaking their bans/DS.DrChrissy 12:54, 6 January 2016 (UTC)

@SageRad: for some reason I have found myself with a little extra time on my hands today so I thought I would try and get a broader perspective on people's opinions of Misplaced Pages and its process. I found this site wikipediocracy. It has some very interesting articles on there such as this and this. It also has some very humorous articles. If you have not been there before, I hope you enjoy it and find it enlightening.DrChrissy 19:02, 6 January 2016 (UTC)

• DrChrissy, I think I have been on your side in various disputes in the past, so maybe you'll listen to a word or two from me. That latest block, that's not an ArbCom block--AE really is not an ArbCom venue. The interaction ban (I had no involvement in that case, as you know), I have no opinion on its merit, but it was imposed and you just have to live with it: your AE request clearly went past the boundaries set for such bans. Your fellow editor SageRad here is wrong on more than one count and is not giving good advice--if we (and that includes you--editors in general) ban everyone who is disruptive in one particular area, there would be hell to pay. Also, "cooling down" blocks don't work and are specifically discouraged, in part, I think, because they're patronizing.

  But I really just wanted to say one thing, having been familiar with you for a few years now: please stop digging. You're in a hole, stop digging. There is a way out of the hole, but this is not it. You can blame ArbCom all you want, but ArbCom does its work based on what evidence is presented. Getting in good graces with ArbCom is not really where it's at since ArbCom also responds to what the community has to say: it's community members you have to win for your case. You won't win Jytdog, it seems to me, but that latest AE case easily sways a more neutral observer away from your case. All the best, Drmies (talk) 02:44, 7 January 2016 (UTC)

@User:Drmies, thank you for your comments.DrChrissy 15:00, 7 January 2016 (UTC)

Genetically modified organisms case modified

DrChrissy's topic ban which currently states that "DrChrissy is indefinitely topic-banned from all pages relating to genetically modified plants and agricultural chemicals, broadly interpreted; appeals of this ban may be requested no earlier than twelve months since the date the case closed" is replaced with "DrChrissy is indefinitely topic-banned from all pages relating to genetically modified organisms, commercially produced agricultural chemicals, and the companies that produce them, broadly interpreted; appeals of this ban may be requested no earlier than twelve months since the date the case closed."

For the Arbitration Committee Amortias (T)(C) 23:05, 6 January 2016 (UTC)

Discuss this at: Misplaced Pages talk:Arbitration Committee/Noticeboard#Genetically modified organisms case modified

@I am One of Many: Thank you for your comment here. It is always nice to receive compliments for the quality of one's content editing. Much appreciated.DrChrissy 15:08, 7 January 2016 (UTC)

Bullying

@SageRad: Hi Sage, you might be interested in this thread which started today. All the best. DrChrissy 15:21, 11 January 2016 (UTC)

....and the thread was closed within 4 hrs - I think this speaks volumes!DrChrissy 16:09, 11 January 2016 (UTC)

Could you elaborate on how it speaks volumes? Note that discussion has continued on Biscuittin's talk page. He is not being ignored or stonewalled, it's just that no one believes his complaint has merit. A general discussion on how bullying should be dealt with is of course fair game, but Biscuittin went about it in completely the wrong way and I don't believe that is actually what he is trying to achieve.--Atlan (talk) 11:39, 12 January 2016 (UTC)

My message was intended as a one-to-one with SageRad and I don't think they need any further elaboration.DrChrissy 16:32, 12 January 2016 (UTC)

Alright, fair enough. I was just curious.--Atlan (talk) 23:58, 12 January 2016 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for January 13

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Hair whorls

Thanks for your edit on the noticeboard. I've been farming most of my life, and I've discovered that while some of the old wives' tales are nonsense, some are true. I don't know if there are any actual scientific studies on hair whorls, but I always heard that the location of the whorl on the head had to do with the formation of the animal's brain. (And where I live, the superstition is that a whorl in the middle of the forehead means a good horse, a whorl above the eyes means a high-strung horse, and a whorl far down on the face means a stupid one.) But temperaments have been selectively bred for, as anybody who's ever had animals knows (Great Pyrenees can be trusted with baby animals because they have been bred for guard work--Thoroughbreds are high-strung because they are bred to have a great drive to run, etc.) Some of it you have to learn through experience and can't get from reading stuff on the internet. And some theories sound good in print but do not work in reality. White Arabian Filly (Neigh) 23:59, 14 January 2016 (UTC)

Hoping you are well

I'm unsure whether my posting here might be unwelcome, but I hope that it's OK. I just saw what you said at another page about your problems with diabetes and the risk that you might have to have amputations, and very truly, my heart went out to you. I feel very sad that you are going through such difficulties, and I hope that you will have a good recovery. --Tryptofish (talk) 22:43, 25 January 2016 (UTC)

Hi Trypto. Thanks for your obviously sincere and genuine concern. Diabetes is a terrible disease for many reasons. I would tell you more, however, I believe there are others out there who might actually use that against me as a violation of my topic ban. Yes, I actually believe that - what a sad state of affairs. Thanks again for your concern.DrChrissy 16:44, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

Sorry

People don't often express appreciation for being prompted to re-read something. Having seen more of your comments, I believe you were being absolutely sincere. I'm both embarrassed and relieved to learn my interpretation was not correct, and I sincerely apologize for my misunderstanding. Burninthruthesky (talk) 21:14, 27 January 2016 (UTC)

@Burninthruthesky: Your apology is accepted - thank you.DrChrissy 16:37, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

Intelligent Design

Your comment at RSN raised an interesting point: a search in The Blind Watchmaker brings up no examples of "intelligent design", but from my own copy Dawkins in his preface refers to "complex design", one of many terms for the teleological argument, on pages 4–6 he discusses William Paley's Natural Theology version of that argument.
Our intelligent design article briefly mentions theological predecessors of the term, and in a footnote gives example of 19th century use of the phrase when discussing God's works and "intelligent direction".
On the first amendment's influence, Timeline of intelligent design outlines the series of court cases which led to "scientific creationism" being rebranded as creation science. After teaching that in public school science classrooms was ruled unconstitutional by Edwards v. Aguillard, the term intelligent design was substituted, with the claim that this was a NASA phrase being used for a new science. Hope you find these clarifications helpful. . . dave souza, talk 10:03, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

Hi Dave, thanks for the clarifications. Much appreciated.DrChrissy 16:39, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

Discretionary sanctions alert

Please carefully read this information:

The Arbitration Committee has authorised discretionary sanctions to be used for pages regarding pseudoscience and fringe science, a topic which you have edited. The Committee's decision is here.

Re: "I think we are now all warned"; no, that doesn't count, but now you're warned. Bishonen | talk 19:44, 29 January 2016 (UTC).

@Bishonen: Oh. I must say I am rather surprised to receive this template individually. Am I editing in a way that violates or is danger of violating DS?DrChrissy 20:05, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

As you can see, it doesn't imply any misconduct regarding your own contributions to date. But the reason I posted it to you in particular was my concern about your tone in the ANI discussion. I make no pretense of following the Parapsychology talkpage, but catching sight of the exchange on ANI, I was in fact concerned about some frivolous and unhelpful, even evasive, posts: . Also this: how are the other users supposed to know of your foot problems? Have you informed them about your health issues? Do you really think the person who said "out for a stroll", and the person who supported his remark, were personally attacking you? I see that you (sort of) withdrew your complaint when you were challenged about it, but saying it at all was ridiculous, however much I sympathize with your medical issues (I have diabetes too). Please don't throw around personal attack accusations frivolously. And I have to agree with BMK that this is playing silly games. Etc. Since you ask.

I rather expect you to come back with a "what about them?" argument, and with some justification too; please feel free to post the same DS alert on other people in the discussion. You simply post this template {{subst:alert|ps}} and sign it. (First check the page history to see they haven't already received it in the past year.) Bishonen | talk 21:48, 29 January 2016 (UTC).

Well "what about them?" is the obvious question, however, I will ask this only rhetorically. Perhaps it would have been more appropriate to post the template to the noticeboard in question for all editors, but of course where you post is your business.DrChrissy 22:06, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

Not really my business, no. This is a very bureaucratic part of Misplaced Pages; where I post is the business of the rule that says it's a user talkpage template; it may only be posted on individual user talkpages. If it is, it has the effect of making the user undeniably aware, and then they can be sanctioned per DS if necessary. If I were to post it on a noticeboard, nobody can be shown to have read it, and nobody can be sanctioned per DS. That's how it works. Arbcom's rules. Note that anybody can post the template, it doesn't have to be an admin. Bishonen | talk 23:52, 29 January 2016 (UTC).

Oh right. Thanks for the clarification.DrChrissy 23:56, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

Veganism edits

I saw that you had reverted my last edit of the above page, also saying i had deleted a load of posts on the talk page. I was glad to hear the last point, because I didn't think I had - I was editing only the article itself. I ddi delete some code which might have had that effect on the talk page. If so, I regret that as I believe previous discussions on talk pages should only ever be edited by the person who made them, or with their permission. Perhaps you can tell me or point me to info which will prevent me doing this again? As a separate issue I think my reversion to exclude commodity status was correct, as the extensive discussion is going round in circles with no end in sight. This to me shows it is a dubious phrase to use in this context. Any comments welcome, thanks in advance. TonyClarke (talk) 11:28, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

Hi Tony, I have commented and apologised at the Veganism Talk page - sorry for any inconvenience.DrChrissy 15:14, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

Bile bear

Hi there,

Leaving this message for you as I think this is something in your wheelhouse. I stumbled across the article for bile bear tonight and was unpleasantly surprised to find that, first off and most glaringly, the lead mentions nothing at all about animal welfare, medicinal efficacy, and other sub-topics that would, I imagine, constitute a good portion of decent sources. It also had several odd bits of fluff (for example, the section ostensibly on farmed bear statistics started with an unsourced paragraph about an initiative to release some bears) and a whole lot of unsourced or poorly sourced content. I removed some things and tagged it, but it's late and I don't see myself having time to do any serious review of this in the near future. My hope is that it's something you may want to take a look at. I may also post to WikiProject Animal Welfare, although I don't know how active that WikiProject is...

Thanks. — Rhododendrites \\ 05:12, 4 February 2016 (UTC)

Thanks very much for this - I will take a look.DrChrissy 19:21, 4 February 2016 (UTC)

Just wanted to say thanks again for all your work to this article. — Rhododendrites \\ 19:14, 10 February 2016 (UTC)

Your comment ...

welcome on Talk:Chicken#Claim_of_holocene_domestication_... Fowler&fowler«Talk» 17:12, 4 February 2016 (UTC)

Hi, did you get a chance to look at my post? You don't have to put the traditional poultry science view in there, but in light of the various objections to the PNAS paper, it shouldn't be highlighted in the fashion that it currently is. Better to say something general, such as: Genetic studies point to multiple maternal origins in Southeast Asia, China, and South Asia, with the South Asian clade the predominant progenitor of chickens found in Africa, Europe and the Americas." Fowler&fowler«Talk» 22:29, 9 February 2016 (UTC)

In the absence of any response from you I have now changed the sentence about genetic studies in the lead of Chicken to a more general statement that I believe reflects the current consensus among investigators; see my post on talk:chicken. Best regards, Fowler&fowler«Talk» 13:32, 11 February 2016 (UTC)

Apologies for the delay in getting to this. Your recent edits on Chicken look fine. Happy editing.DrChrissy 19:09, 11 February 2016 (UTC)

Revert

If you want to revert back you will need to undo another edit. You just removed my notice that I fixed the table. To revert the table back you will need to undo this edit. -- GB fan 19:12, 4 February 2016 (UTC)

Hi GB fan. Thanks very much for this. Extremely helpful.DrChrissy 19:16, 4 February 2016 (UTC)

RE: Closure of AN/I Discussion

The consensus is that you don't have a leg to stand on. If you actually took the time to read what folks have been telling you, you'd see that you have little to no chance of getting what you want, and the longer it dragged on, the more likely you would have received a block. I did you a favor. Now don't bother me about this again. Drop the stick. --Tarage (talk) 21:35, 6 February 2016 (UTC)

Noted.DrChrissy 22:15, 6 February 2016 (UTC)

@Tarage: Please could you confirm that you have banned me from your talk page - I have never seen it expressed as an edit summary before.DrChrissy 01:18, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

Do not ping me again. --Tarage (talk) 02:22, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

Requiem?

Dear DrChrissy, is this your twilight time on Misplaced Pages? It pisses me off. I've enjoyed collaborating with you on some significant articles on Misplaced Pages where you and I, and only you and I, maintain standards. If you are going to persist in that most quixotic activity on Misplaced Pages – questing for justice, rationality, decency... whatever... on such unlikely venues as odious drama boards and surreal "arbcom deliberation" pages, then the outcome is simple. They will do what they always do and run a sword through you (siteban you). It sounds like you are running your health down also. If I could command and control you, I would direct you stop dead in the water right now, radically reassess and learn buddhist meditation. But since I can't control you, should I prepare a requiem for you? --Epipelagic (talk) 06:39, 9 February 2016 (UTC)

Hi Epi. Hopefully your proposed preparations are not needed now and won't be in the future. Thanks for your concern about my mental and physical health - but please don't worry too much. As you are aware, over the last 12 months or so on WP, I have been followed and abused, lied about, taunted, provoked, etc. I have now tired of this and along with a growing swell of decent-minded editors with integrity, I am discussing various aspects of editor's/admins mis-behaviour and how this should be dealt with. I will not sink to their tactics so I should avoid the sword, however, especially after the ArbCom case, I realise these things do not always go as expected. I will be careful. I have not given up on content editing completely - I have been updating the Bile bear article and just created Category:Electroreceptive animals amongst others. Once again, thanks for your concern. All the best. DrChrissy 18:40, 10 February 2016 (UTC)

I too wish you only happy music. I just saw your question at AE, and I figured I could answer it here, because I do know the answer. You are free to post about it in terms of your own restrictions, just as SageRad is free to post about it in terms of his. But you must not post about it in terms of anyone else, so Sage should not post in an AE section about you (hypothetically), and you should not post in the section about him unless you have a question about how it applies to you. --Tryptofish (talk) 19:37, 10 February 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for that explanation - that makes it much clearer. These topic bans are so problematic. Whilst there are many who feel they are a clear line, they are not. I don't think it is fully possible to understand the difficulties of trying to stay as as a productive editor unless you have experienced living under one. There is currently discussion about whether admins should be voted upon or not. I wonder whether a prerequisite of becoming an admin should be living under a topic ban (in their favourite editing area) for one month. This would give them a sense of how easy it is to stray into areas which others perceive as a violation.DrChrissy 18:53, 11 February 2016 (UTC)

And as if by magic, an editor who has not edited the page since 2008, suddenly arrives at Bile bear and makes edits that leave it an absolute minefield for me to edit because of a topic ban they were significantly involved in being imposed on me.DrChrissy 20:53, 11 February 2016 (UTC)

Your comment

That's news to me. I've been doing it for over two years, I often see others do it, and yours is the first hint that it's "frowned upon". It's useful information about the nature of my edit. Can you say why it's frowned upon? ―Mandruss ☎ 17:49, 11 February 2016 (UTC)

Hi Mandruss. I'm glad that in my post I said "I think.."! I can't find where I read it is frowned upon - if I ever did! I apologise for any inconvenience and I will go back to the article and strike my comment.DrChrissy 18:14, 11 February 2016 (UTC)

Ok, thanks. ―Mandruss ☎ 18:26, 11 February 2016 (UTC)

Edit revert at Cheetah

Hi! I saw that you reverted my edit in Cheetah with good faith. Thanks for your vigilance. Actually I am in the course of improving the article, and trying as much as possible to keep the article ready for readers any moment. Not all can be worked out in my sandbox. I assure you that I will try to make it look better even whilst I am working on it. Presently I am re-adding info from the old revision, but that will be tomorrow, late here. Thanks again. Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 18:42, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

@Sainsf: Hi Sainsf. You can always leave "Work in progress" in the edit summary and that will stop editors like me jumping in before you have finished. With an established article such as Cheetah, it is sometimes better to discuss large changes at the Talk page before making the changes. You can also advertise your sandbox and changes can be agreed there before moving to the article. Happy editing. DrChrissy 18:53, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

Thank you, I will add "work in progress" from now on; large changes are not really involved, and I will keep the article readable. Thanks again. Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 03:07, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

Hi DrChrissy. FYI I will be away from now, returning only for the GA Cup and a few other simpler articles. Please look at the changes I have made to this article, I believe I have not left loose strands this time. I will return to working on this after a few months. Thank you. Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 16:28, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

Thanks very much for the notification. I'll have a look, and of course other editors are welcome to make their own input. All the best.DrChrissy 16:31, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

IP addresses

IP addresses are not "registered". IPv6 addresses are substantially more dynamic than IPv4 addresses. You have to look at subnet masks, usually at least the /64. Guy (Help!) 22:12, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

I have asked you not to post to my Talk page. Please respect this.DrChrissy 22:18, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

@JzG: Just so we can be crystal clear on this, you are now banned from my Talk page.DrChrissy 23:18, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

Cheetah (1)

Thanks for your edits, but I would like to know what exactly you did to the introduction of "Ecology and behaviour", where they discuss territories. I am on vacation from this but I managed to drop by and add some stuff. You see, I tried to keep as much as I could of the original material, it was good but unsourced. I had to remove a few points but I have a lot of literature to look in, so if it were true I could re-add it. Presently the section shows a lot of redundancy as both the previous material as well as my edits are there. The subheadings look wrongly placed, too. Should I contact editors at the article talk page? But whom should I contact? And the issue as far as I can see is the expansion; I am taking care not to delete anything unduly (don't know what happened to "Vocalizations", it was deleted by mistake I am afraid). I will resume editing when we reach a consensus and, of course, if I am free. I love this article, and wish to take this to FA status through collaboration if others wish to help here. If I have done something wrong, please tell me and I will rectify my error. Thank you. Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 12:21, 17 February 2016 (UTC)

@Sainsf: This discussion is about the content of the article. This means the discussion is better at the Talk page of the article as there will be more interested editors over there rather than here. So, let's take the discussion there.DrChrissy 17:09, 17 February 2016 (UTC)

rewriting

It feels a little odd for me to be giving advice to someone who is probably a better and more experienced writer than I am, but one of the aspects I have the most experience with by now is revising WP articles. The most difficult thing to do is in revising is to deal with duplication; either when one finds existing duplication or when one feels it necessary to put new material what would duplicate material that is already less well stated in another place in an article. When people are trying to make a case for something, they often fall into the pattern of saying some of the key points several times in several places. I know I tend to do that when I am deliberately advocating for something, and I assume I do it also when I fell about something strongly even if I do not at the time recognize it. I think some of it is that one cares very much and wants to make sure one has said it, and also that one takes what will have an emotional impact and -- in addition to putting it wherever it really logically belongs-- one puts it both in the beginning to set the expectations, and then again at the end to leave the intended impression.

Further, when people are deliberately or unconsciously advocating, They also tend to bring in fully sufficient background to make sure the reader is seeing the actual subject in what they think is the proper overall context. This may be necessary in stand-alone writing, but it isn't in a collected work like this, where the related information is given by linking. A further technique that is easy to do in works like this is to use illustrations, and especially multiple similar illustrations, which will leave more of an emotional than an informative purpose. The art of doing conceal advocacy consists doing these things without making the advocacy obvious by actually stating what the reader is intended to conclude. I see all three of these in the article on Pain in crustaceans --I turned to that one of your examples first, because it is also a topic where I have myself strong feelings that are the same as yours-- and I looked at Bile Bear for similar reasons. I have no idea if they were deliberate or unconscious. I'm not going to deal further with this or the other articles; I generally avoid working on articles where I have strong feelings just as I avoid persistently working on any article where I encounter strong opposition. I'm not really bother by encountering this sort of writing when I oppose the implied or explicit viewpoint--I expect it from my ideological opponents. I'm much more concerned with it when I actually agree. I feel I owe it to you to expand on my comment at ANI, where I wanted to avoid detail. DGG ( talk ) 04:14, 7 March 2016 (UTC)

Hi, and apologies for taking so long to reply - I have been rather busy elsewhere as you probably know.

Am I correct in thinking that you have concerns about the background section of Pain in crustaceans? If so, I am in some agreement with you. This is largely (perhaps entirely) based on the background of Pain in fish. This was developed along with highly experienced editors. At the time I felt this was a little "general", but I deferred to others editing the fish article. Transferring this to the crustaceans page is perhaps a "generalisation" too far. I tend to edit so that articles are pretty much stand-alone. Perhaps I have taken this too far with te crustaceans article. This could be remedied by editing the Pain in animals article with the background material, and then sticking to specifics for fish, crustaceans, amphibians etc. Are these the concerns you have? DrChrissy 18:29, 13 March 2016 (UTC)

/* Thailand Siamese Cat */ (This is not a Siamese cat it is a Birman Seal point)

I did not add the section itself i just corrected an obvious error!!!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Apfan (talk • contribs) 20:05, 7 March 2016 (UTC)

Yes I saw that. Your correction led me to read that part of the article and then delete it. I do not hold you responsible for introducing the section - I did not even look at the history to find out who did. Happy editing. DrChrissy 20:10, 7 March 2016 (UTC)

Anecdotal reports

Hi, DrChrissy - the reason Alligator gar specifically stated "anecdotal reports" and anecdotal evidence in scientific reports is because that's exactly what they are - anecdotal, no scientific proof, word of mouth, supposition - in other words, there are no "official reports" and no scientific evidence to confirm or deny the claim; therefore, it's still considered "anecdotal". We cannot say anything in WP voice that is not official or verifiable, especially when the cited sources use the words claim, or "it has been reported", or refer to it as "anecdotal evidence". I know you were trying to be helpful but I don't think it's accurate to say in WP voice that they can grow to be 10 ft. The verifiable facts tell us that they get heavier not longer after they reach a certain size (under 10 ft.) - refer to the official records which verify the largest alligator gar ever caught and recorded was about 8-1/2 ft. long. Following are some official verifiable reports that support what I'm saying is accurate about how their weight increases rather than their length, , , . I went ahead and put the information back the way it was when it passed the GA review. Thanks for giving me another opportunity to research and check for verifiable information that would justify the removal of anecdotal. I simply don't believe we're there, yet. Atsme 22:34, 8 March 2016 (UTC)

Oh I see. I had not realised there was such a relationship between length and weight, i.e. they get heavier but not longer (it would be worth introducing this into the text if you have an RS - does this relationship have a name?). I was mainly going on the fact that the reports were from a reputable museum. Presumably these reports had been checked, at which point, I would say that usually it is no longer anecdotal...but I can see why you might be wanting an even higher level of verification. Keep up the good work. DrChrissy 22:54, 8 March 2016 (UTC)

I feel a little better to learn that I'm not the only one who is getting heavier without getting longer! --Tryptofish (talk) 23:41, 8 March 2016 (UTC)

I started about the age of 37! DrChrissy 18:25, 9 March 2016 (UTC)

I turned 60 a couple of weeks ago, so I can hardly remember back that far! --Tryptofish (talk) 19:12, 9 March 2016 (UTC)

AN/I

No problem. I do hope your topic ban gets lifted - it most certainly does look as if it will happen. Regards, --Ches (talk) 18:56, 11 March 2016 (UTC)

Cheetah (2)

Hi friend! I am sorry if I am being impatient, but it looks like it is only you, me and Mcelite who are discussing the changes made to the article. I feel you are busy in other things at the moment, and even Mcelite is not available. As our discussions are progressing slowly, I can not work on the article. I assure you that I will make changes carefully and according to the standards followed in Tiger and Lion. Please do not revert the changes made by me before seeking an explanation from me; I carefully add appropriate info along with credible sources. Details like the arrangement of sections, renaming them can be taken care of at the Good Article review stage, we need not worry about this too much now. I have experience having worked on several articles in the past. Please allow me to continue with the article. Thanks. Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 18:06, 13 March 2016 (UTC)

Hi. Please go ahead and make your edits. The normal way of progressing is to discuss large, or controversial changes, at the Talk page before making the edit. I do not own the page, and I have not prevented you from making edits, so please do go ahead. Reverting changes is also a normal part of the editing process. Please do not take these personally. Have you read WP:BRD - this may help you understand. DrChrissy 18:11, 13 March 2016 (UTC)

Thank you. I understand the policy, and did not take all this personally at all. Perhaps I am not used to reverts, but I must learn a lot more. Please do not misunderstand me, you are a responsible editor! Let me inform you that I will be working on the Ecology and behaviour section, and some rearrangements and renaming are on the way. I will ping you to take a look at the section when it is ready, it is really a mess just now! Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 18:19, 13 March 2016 (UTC)

About the revert, I could not get why you reverted it. You see, I am working on the full text of the section and the subsections are really troublesome in the meantime. Please understand. I believe the Ecology section will be done by tomorrow. Please don't revert Speed as well! Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 19:31, 13 March 2016 (UTC)

Edit conflict: I'm sorry to have reverted, but you made a massive! edit containing many problems. These included mixed use of "%" and "percent", mixed citing formats and changing of established and non-controversial headings. I suggest you edit the text sticking to one sub-section at a time, e.g. work on "Reproduction" until you are happy with this and then save.. This makes it easier for editors and readers to understand your changes, and for us to discuss these on the Talk page if necessary. Furthermore, by working on one subsection at a time, you can "finish" this quicker without needing to leave "work in progress". I really hope this helps. DrChrissy 19:38, 13 March 2016 (UTC)

Alright, please do not feel offended. This is a new situation for me, but I will try to work within subsections. Sorry for my silly errors. I will try to work within them, but can they be removed after the whole section is done? It looks a bit ugly to have short subsections. I will update on this tomorrow, once I am done with the whole job. Sorry again! Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 19:44, 13 March 2016 (UTC)

Don't worry, I am not offended at all. Yes, those errors can be corrected, the problem is that when you save a massive edit like that last one, it becomes much more difficult to see where these have been made, and much more work to correct them. It also means that we can not advise you about them so that you can avoid making them in the future. DrChrissy 19:50, 13 March 2016 (UTC)

Sure, won't be repeated. I was asking about the subsections - are they temporary? Or must they be there? Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 19:53, 13 March 2016 (UTC)

That is not my decision to make. I like them that way, but you clearly do not. We appear to need other editor's views here. Perhaps you might like to raise the question on the Talk page, with an indication of how you might combine the sections. Sorry, but this can be a slow process. There is no need to rush - the article is not going away. DrChrissy 19:58, 13 March 2016 (UTC)

Sure. I think we can leave them as they are till the article is done. Thanks a ton for all your help! I learned a lot. Sainsf <^>_{Talk all words} 20:00, 13 March 2016 (UTC)

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Balut

Thanks for cleaning up that article, and apologies if I edit-conflicted with you at some point. If you get fed up with it, ping me and I can finish up. Ian (Wiki Ed) (talk) 18:45, 24 March 2016 (UTC)

Hi, no problem at all. It's bloody irritating when it happens, but that has nothing to do with you at all. Please carry on - I would not want to stifle any motivation to edit. All the best DrChrissy 18:51, 24 March 2016 (UTC)

Unfortunately there are several articles needing help, so I'm busy for a while. Thanks -- Ian (Wiki Ed) (talk) 18:54, 24 March 2016 (UTC)

Cheetah

Hi. I have completed work on most of the article, except the lead, status and threats, and conservation sections. You may like to check the improvements. I will complete my work on the article in the next few weeks and nominate this at the GAN. Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 13:23, 25 March 2016 (UTC)

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Categorisation

The Misplaced Pages categorisation system is hierarchical. If an article is in the category "Animals in China" it should not also be in the category "Animals". because "Animals in China" is included in the category "Animals". Otherwise the top categories become unmanageably big. The point of categories is to help users find articles they might not know exist. They need to be fairly small, ideally to fit on a page, so they can easily be scanned. I suggest you read WP:SUBCAT. Rathfelder (talk) 19:48, 27 March 2016 (UTC)

So why would you remove the category "animal welfare" from Animals (Scientific Procedures) Act 1986‎? DrChrissy 20:00, 27 March 2016 (UTC)

Because it belongs in Category:Animal rights and welfare legislation in the United Kingdom which is a sub-sub-category of category:Animal welfare and rights by country, which is a subcategory of Category:Animal welfare. Rathfelder (talk) 20:59, 27 March 2016 (UTC)

Oh, I see. Thanks for the explanation. DrChrissy 21:01, 27 March 2016 (UTC)

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i am hungry for anti vandalism barnstar

please come to my talk page to make it full

coyote entry

Hey Dr. Chrissy,

Just wanted to thank you for resolving the dispute over the usage of "nuclear family" with regards to the Wikipage on the coyote. I have from time to time made revisions on Misplaced Pages, many times to only see those revisions get changed. I thought in this particular case that my logic was sound, why Massone enjoys the use of this term in this instance baffles me, especially when one looks at the Wikipage on nuclear family!!

Can coyotes be married?!! LOL.

Sincerely, AA Pilot

No problem. Glad to be of help. In answer to your question, coyotes can NOT be married because they have no fingers to put the ring on.  ;-) DrChrissy 19:56, 2 April 2016 (UTC)

Cheetah article

I see you keep an eye on the cheetah article. A user, Sainsf, made a large number of edits a few weeks back, and I am less than impressed with them. I don't think the prose is particularly great, but the real gripe is that his modifications have completed mangled some of the sourcing and introduced outdated sources with regards to top speed and the like. Would you back me up if I reverted everything he has done and re-added it more carefully? I'm sure some of it must be useful. --BowlAndSpoon (talk) 19:09, 4 April 2016 (UTC)

Hi. Yes I would. I am sure Sainsf means well and is willing to communicate, but has gone at the article like a bull in a china shop. I have warned them on 2 occasions, I think, to take things more slowly and that contentious changes should go to the talk page, but these seem to have been partly ignored. They are actually trying to get Cheetah to GA or FA standard. I think a complete reversion and then slow introductions with several eyes on these would be the best approach. DrChrissy 19:16, 4 April 2016 (UTC)

@BowlAndSpoon: I am sorry if I have done anything wrong and have been too fast, please let me know what needs to be fixed. Should we go to the GOCE? A few of us did discuss changes at the talk page, but I am afraid I was too impatient to see the article improved. I have nominated it at the GAN, but I am sure we can fix these issues and the nomination need not be withdrawn. I do not have plans for its FAC at least in the next few months. I am not sure if a complete reversion would be a good idea as it took me a lot of efforts to assemble all the info. All I did was in good faith, please let me know my flaws. Sorry again. Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 08:44, 6 April 2016 (UTC)

Vandalism at Leopard

A lot of vandalism by IPs has been going on here, I and others are tired of reverting these edits. I see you are an administrator, could you guide me on what can be done here? Thanks, Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 08:41, 6 April 2016 (UTC)

First, I'm afraid I'm not an administrator. However, you/I can apply to get the page protected. The vandalism has been done by several IP's, but is probably the same person. It seems to have settled down now. Perhaps they have gone to bed or they are away from their computer, whichever, I suggest we leave it for a few hours and see if it starts again. The best way to initially deal with this is simply undo the vandalism. Don't leave any edit summary that lets them know you are irritated - "dont feed the trolls". DrChrissy 12:46, 6 April 2016 (UTC)

Oh, I thought you were one. Alright, I will wait. Sainsf <^>_{Feel at home} 14:19, 6 April 2016 (UTC)

Back to ANI

Misplaced Pages:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents#DrChrissy_.28yet_again.29

I assume you are familiar with the drill.

jps (talk) 18:12, 8 April 2016 (UTC)

Walk away

You are being baited as was I. Just walk away and let an admin deal with it. Once you make your points attempting to rebut every allegation that is created will only frustrate you and create a wall of text no admin will wade through. Let the major points on both sides be clear and clearly seen; let the rest fall back into the shadows where they belong.(Littleolive oil (talk) 21:00, 8 April 2016 (UTC))

Illegitimi non carborundum --Aspro (talk) 21:03, 8 April 2016 (UTC)

Thanks both for the advice - much appreciated. DrChrissy 21:13, 8 April 2016 (UTC)

Dog

"Wolves kill dogs wherever the two canids occur." Just because one authority says this, that does not make it a generalization across the English-speaking Misplaced Pages. Other writers disagree. Regards, William Harris • talk • 20:42, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

William, first, this discussion is about the content within an article and therefore should really be raised at the article's Talk page where it will get more eyes from interested editors. The main reason I deleted that part of the sentence was use of the word "authority". It sounds very grand, but it is unnecessary. Is it a reliable source - if it is, that is enough. If you know of other sources which disagree with this one, please edit the article to indicate this and gain a balanced article. DrChrissy 21:06, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

My concern is not the quality of citation or the content, it is your generalization of what just one person wrote. Better balanced view now expressed. William Harris • talk • 09:20, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

I don't understand why you have raised this thread! Why did you not just make those changes in the first place rather than coming to my Talk page. DrChrissy 12:06, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

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Ant self recognition

Hello, I cannot see your arguments for deleting the Ant section on Mirror Test. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.225.244.180 (talk) 03:50, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

There is a principle on wikipedia that extraordinary claims require extraordinary sources. It is also much preferred that we use secondary sources rather than primary. I think it is fair to say that the claim ants can recognise themselves in mirrors is extraordinary. However, the source is in a predatory journal - i.e. the authors might have paid to publish the paper, and it is a primary source. If we could find a reliable secondary source, I would be happy to reintroduce the content. DrChrissy 12:10, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

I'm not disputing the removal of the material, but I'd like to point out that the fact that authors pay a fee does not make a journal predatory. It is standard in open access journals, and even in many highly reputable closed access journals, for authors to pay a publication fee. What makes a journal predatory is false statements about review and impact. Looie496 (talk) 13:20, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

Yes, thanks for that clarification. I think the IP should read our Predatory open access publishing article. That is a much fuller account of the risk of using these journal as sources. DrChrissy 13:27, 12 April 2016 (UTC)

Thank you for your work

Hi Dr Chrissy, thank you for helping improve the animal welfare page in the UK. I personally don't know a great deal about specific UK animal welfare issues (not from the UK), only from what I've picked up from reading online UK papers. I'm sure some local UK editors will build up the page.

The animal welfare proposals section has just one source at the moment (the Ulster Unionist party), which is only because I happened upon that information while I was researching online articles to do with animal cruelty sentencing laws around the UK - and I thought "aha", a "proposals" section would be a good growth section to get people thinking about the possibilities regarding animal welfare. Anticla rutila (talk) 06:26, 17 April 2016 (UTC)

This made me laugh

This reminded me of what happened here a few weeks ago! If you haven't seen it yet, hope you enjoy. :-) --Ches (talk) (contribs) 16:17, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

Thanks so much for that! Hilarious! I've heard the game on the radio many times and thought it was very funny, but I've never watched it before and never heard our beloved Rachel on it. Thanks - cheered my day up immensely!

No problem! :-) --Ches (talk) (contribs) 08:55, 23 April 2016 (UTC)

Re: DYK/Organized Horse Fighting

I've appended some additional comments. Just a minor mix-up that needs fixing, and it should be ready to go. - Mailer Diablo 02:48, 22 April 2016 (UTC)

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Regarding reversions on Human Penis page

Hi DrChrissy,

Just had a quick question regarding your revision of the content added yesterday to the Human Penis page by @123hs:. Was the revision due to our use of American English or was it also the content we had added/edited? Just wanted to see if it would be possible to put the content additions back in if we make sure we use the American English or whether there was a problem with the content?

Thank you in advance! JS.Chester (talk) 10:59, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

Hi. Because this is a content issue, I will answer over at the Talk page. See you there. DrChrissy 13:31, 27 April 2016 (UTC)

Sorry DrChrissy, but following on from the Quackery discussion below, at WP:RESTRICT your Tban is logged as "from human health and medicine, and WP:MEDRS related discussions, broadly construed." It seems like your recent involvement at the article mentioned in this section would very easily be seen as falling under this, probably best to disengage there as well. Thanks... Zad68 16:34, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

Human penis is about human anatomy. DrChrissy 17:20, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

Anatomy is clearly a branch of medicine, I'd be very surprised to find an uninvolved admin wouldn't think it falls under "human medicine... broadly construed". Please disengage there. Zad68 17:25, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

... which is an aspect of human health, "broadly construed", I'd have thought. Blimey you do like tweaking the lion's tail. Alexbrn (talk) 17:26, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

Our own Medicine article states - "Medicine... is the science and practice of the diagnosis, treatment, and prevention of disease." Next you will be suggesting I should not be editing articles such as Beard, Hair or earlobe. DrChrissy

I think it's pretty clear this page falls under "human medicine, broadly construed." You've heard my concern, now use your own best judgment. If you're going to continue on at that topic I (or someone else) will open a discussion at an appropriate noticeboard. Zad68 17:56, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

I will not be bullied away from this page or any other human anatomy pages. If you, or any other editor, decide to make such a clearly erroneous claim at a noticeboard, be prepared for an immediate boomerang for wasting the communities time. You have been warned about this. DrChrissy 18:01, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

No problem, let's get some clarity before it becomes an issue, I have opened at thread at ANI here. Zad68 18:19, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

I can't see it there. DrChrissy 18:28, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

It got removed accidentally in someone else's edit conflict, restored now. Zad68 18:33, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

Quackery

Aren't you topic-banned wrt human health? Alexbrn (talk) 16:13, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

It is actually human medicine, but I have struck my comments as I am not trying to find the limits of my TBan. DrChrissy 16:20, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

Crikey, well then editing quackery wouldn't be so much testing the limits and parachuting into to the centre wearing a fluorescent mankini and singing Oops!... I Did It Again through a megaphone ... ! Alexbrn (talk) 16:30, 28 April 2016 (UTC)